Marketing Against The Grain

it's never been a more important time to have an incredible story about your product on this episode we have rachel the product marketing leader for hubspot and she is going to show you three ai tools that can transform your product position in your product story overnight and how to go from average to world class in a very short amount of time all of that and more on this episode of marketing against the grain here's a quick word from our sponsor hubspot help tumblr solve a big problem they needed to move fast to produce trending content but their marketing team was stuck waiting on engineers to quote every single email campaign now they use hubspot customer platform to email real time trending content to millions of users in just seconds the impact three times more engagement and double the content creation wanna move faster like tumblr visit hubspot dot com alright on this episode we're gonna talk about something we have not covered as much and that is product marketing but because it's the marketing against the grain show we have to do it from an ai perspective we have rachel lies to as the fearless product marketing leader at hubspot everything good that comes out of hubspot in relation to product marketing is her and her team welcome rachel to the show thank you what an introduction it's so happy to be here okay so you're not just a great product marketing team you're also a team that has adopted ai across all of the things you do and so we're gonna be able to show people some practical use cases of how you use ai for product marketing but first because kip and i have not covered product marketing in a whole lot on the podcast in the last couple of months why don't you give people a refresher on product marketing and why it's important absolutely so product marketing is really at the simplest level telling people what your product does why it's important how it will help the customer and also doing that consistently across channels so it's so so so important to make sure that whenever a customer is interacting with your company they are saying the same message and the same value props and thinking in the age of ai this is becoming more and more important as there's more content out there and more channels that people are using so rachel why don't you tell us about some of the must have ai use cases for product marketing so i think there's a couple of things that we have really thought about when using ai so first all the customer contacts you have interviews research decks and transcripts with your customers anything you can get your hands on that helps you understand the customer then there's product context you have one pager you have again decks there's positioning docs there's a research and then of course you wanna pull in some internal context like think about linkedin posts that have done really well or just tone of voice and then market context so there's all these materials that really you can use to make your product marketing even stronger and we have a couple examples as you mentioned to go through where we show how you use that to create your positioning docs and your sales decks to your one pager your talk tracks it's really incredible what we've been able to do yeah one of the cool features of open ai or even cloud is their ability to basically ingest internal data and then pair that with external data so like one of the thing you can choose to right off the bat if you're listening to the show and you have not done a lot of product marketing or you're just not really sure how to even get started you can literally just ask claude to build you a ideal customer profile and you can just say like use all of the documents in my g drive that are related look at my emails and then you can say pair that with external data that's like really powerful i was doing that over the weekend and it'll will actually build you some pretty great ic which are for our audience ideal customer profiles and kieran we did this in the hubspot and open show right because we have the deep research connector with hubspot and chat gp if you're a hubspot user you can literally just ask chat gp what it thinks your ic is and break it all down based on your existing data too right so you can do that and then once you have a rough ic you can ask the l to go and balance it with more information and let's say you're just getting started you don't have a a team of people doing product marketing just record some of your customer calls put that with the data you have and you will have a pretty robust like ideal customer profile and persona pretty quickly right that'll be way better than what most people have yeah i think one of the things i do on a daily basis is i take some content that myself or my team is written i plug it into one of our cloud projects your custom gp that have again those customer transcripts and interviews and say does this resonate with the customer what would you specifically change what would you keep and so that not only improves the content but it also teaches me the simple things that i need to be including when speaking to the customer right the ability for ai to mimic people if you if it's getting enough information is pretty powerful because you can actually start to have real conversations with your customers which for an introvert like me i can now just train an ai model to act like a customer like a voice model speak with it for a long time and another have to actually talk to a human which is like really excited it's actually funny one of our first iterations of one of our personas was training ai and then asking it questions like where do you want like to eat where do you wanna job just to get to know the persona more so definitely with you on that one you know there was this a weird app that kip and eye wasn't weird but like there was this a pretty fast growth ai company i think fate wasn't meta bought a kit character that they are google google bought it google bought it and so they had this like you were able to go and create traditional characters or you could go create characters in comic books or whatever and you it was actually really popular with kids they would go speak to their favorite comic book heroes or people in shows and they can have a conversation with them there should be something like that for people just like aggregate and everyone who has different pain points and you have entrepreneurs can go there and speak to different people with different pain points and figure out what products they actually want to build for them but that's a lovable slash rep idea because then you could actually pair that with your new and growing in five code and entrepreneurs but why don't you show us maybe one of the use cases your team uses day in day out for ai and product marketing definitely i'll start with the one that was really the biggest unlock for me with ai in general like i think everyone has their moment where things click and all of a sudden it works and this was mine so this first one is a quad project so on the product marketing team we have cloud projects for all of our products for all of our customer proof our competitive intelligence and this is our growth gabby project which is essentially for our customer persona and so in here we have details that you know again this is what kieran was talking about a second ago you're an ai with extensive data about ro gabby your database like pull in from customer call transcripts the profile all this research so that we have everything and then we have some details on what your role is again how to create that vision doc so i am going to use our operations hub positioning from twenty twenty and ask it to essentially update that based on the research that is in this project so i wanna update this positioning doc from twenty twenty since then we have updated our personas can you take a first pass at updating the positioning using the following framework and the framework i wanna use is what's actually in the project details here so sometimes it actually just does this automatically but just in case i'm going to outline this and this is really how we organize our positioning so as soon as i run that it's gonna start looking through all the project details and pull up just a new version of positioning and while it does that the other thing that to mention that i love doing with this project and again our other product projects is using current positioning that we're working on and saying hey tell me exactly what resonates with this persona what doesn't resonate and provide me very specifics on what to change and we've actually saved a ton of rounds of feedback and reviews because of this kim can talk to that as well because he health like that well first of all i love that we built this i use it all the time like i was just using it last week rachel and i was like it just gives me such good feedback because there's a level of depth to it because it has all that context about here or is the type of person we're talking to here's what they care about it has all those conversations that it can go in reference and what's pretty amazing is it tells you exactly what to make better yeah and the magic in something like product marketing versus maybe other parts of marketing it's an iteration game can you keep refining it and making it more interesting clearer or simpler anytime you're talking about your product initially it's like it's a little foggy and you don't know what to focus on and going through this like changes that dramatically and changed it like in minutes instead of like hours or days right could you give the listeners an idea of what content you've put into the cloud project definitely to make it so accurate in terms of its feedback yeah so we have a ton of market research that is first foremost then we have customer interviews and we make sure they're representative of different company sizes different regions just different perspectives and then we also include one pager or sales sex just like anything that has been an output one of the things that is the most important that i will stress is we do make a habit of every quarter we update what's in the project because things are changing rapidly especially right now and we wanna make sure that as customer expectations are evolving as we get new research and we have the latest in there that was gonna be one of my questions as in like you were creating a cloud project is it like swap out data to keep the freshest data in there yeah it's usually swapping out data i would say on the customers it's just it's adding to it but it is so important and we do that across again all of the product call projects we have as well but i think this has been an unlock for not just me as i was saying earlier using ai but a lot of people on the team because if you're writing an email or you're creating a landing page running it through this to really understand if it resonates it'll again give you these specific feedback and add in some data in quotes and it's really phenomenal and you can do this in a chat custom gp or at a cloud project rachel i think you've done both is that right and like what do you like better like give people a little tool and technology recap if they were doing this okay so i tend to run the same prompt through both to see what responses i get which i think are better but one of the things i was more dependent on claude when i cannot choose the model in custom gp yes yeah right now that i can use o three exactly don't know i've i'm started using chad gb t more but most of our projects actually live in cloth i like have this internal battle over it i just wanna make sure we emphasize that for the listeners that because i've been waiting for that feature forever if you were in projects or you were in custom gp and open ai you couldn't specify the model to use for that product or custom gp team and they seem to have updated that like two weeks ago yeah which was really awesome because it makes all of those things much much usable and i agree i think that for even me everything is gravitate across the open ai because of that yeah i feel like i'm cheating on claude and i feel guilty because this is not i do feel like i've been using chad team more now because of o three most of our projects do still live in claude but one of the things that i would recommend to everyone is you know different people in your company have access to different things so we have also organized all the docs just in our google docs and organize folder so that in the future we will have the flexibility to do it in claude and chat between and gemini wherever it is and huge shout to jeff davis and tim on my team who who did all that work well one of the things that might get you back to claude and we're gonna cover that on an episode over the next week or two is claude released and you feature that'll allow you to build host apps and so you can build an app and then you can integrate your cloud api so theoretically actually you could have an internal tool that does all that position and they can just upload a document it will actually give them the pdf and return and so the ability to turn all of these projects and things into lightweight internal apps is actually gonna be really interesting i think we're gonna build a couple of those for our listeners yeah it's one of the reasons i like having it in both places because every week one might be better than the other and i just like to be able to compare it right gb five will come in july and just do all of this either say go do it and just do it all also we'll grab it between both will just say for everybody watching rachel that i think you're kinda getting at is that the models in chat gp seem a little better especially three right now the user experience of managing the content the project and maybe getting custom app output is way better in club right yeah you almost need to do a little bit of both of them if you want the absolute best outcome if it's like a really important project look if you're joining this episode with rachel you're gonna love this we just dropped the ai interview arsenal you'll get an interactive demo where you can actually experience what it's like to be interviewed by ai go through it yourself right now and see how surprisingly smooth is plus rachel's throwing in her go to ai prompts that'll help you automate the whole customer interview process no more scheduling nightmares no more transcription headaches this will give you real insights from real customers fast click the link of the description below now let's get back to today's show okay so you have a product position in done i wanna like give you a quick demo a little bit later in this episode of fun thing i did around product position but why don't you take us through a another use case so one of the most exciting use cases we have worked on is around competitive intelligence so we have been you know using saw other software throughout the year to host all of our competitive intelligence all of our battle cards and now it's all in notebook l ben conte put this together i'm gonna demo in a second but i will say usage has spiked people just like love interacting with it more our sales reps love it in this so this is awesome it's very exciting so there are so many so many different things you can ask this i know our reps are using it on calls to basically ask well you know this objection just came up what do i say and it immediately comes back with the answer if i have a couple of sample prompts with like give me one punchy success story i can quote provide the sentence then the stat after so just to explain this the listeners one of the things part mark can do is they create these kinda competitive guides and so anytime a competitor comes up on a sales call or as part of the buy process you were able to kind of give all of the talking points around that and what you've done here in notebook l is you've built individual notebooks per competitor yeah so for example i can say i'm going up against competitor x pull in the top three reasons that hubspot would win in these scenarios or someone saying like hubspot doesn't grow with like let's actually do that one i'm on a call with a prospect who is concerned that they won't grow with hubspot what should i say and that's gonna come back with what to respond with it's gonna come back with sources that it pulls from and so then you can ask follow question options as well so here's not only like some key talking points here some stats here's a customer proves very cool here there's just a ton of things here i love this at the end as well that has again like what to really emphasize there's just so much information in here what kind of information have you added into each of these battle cards like if i was a person watching this and i wanted to start to create some of these competitive battle cards what is the data i wanna add to my notebook to get this yeah i would say top talking points the feature comparisons between like yourself and your competitors any type of customer proof anything around what has happened when you've switched from a competitor to your own solution when does that information come from all of our research so market research customer research like anything you can have in there and then it's or we organize ours by competitor you can talk to notebook right you could have a conversation with it can have an audio overview and you can create podcasts about all your competitors yeah so one of the things that we do whenever there's like a big announcements from a competitor is we essentially create a podcast we've called it internally hot takes before and where the different competitive analyst talk through it but again you can create that podcast to just listen to a lot of information in a much easier way and again we've seen usage with our sales team skyrocket using this because it's just so much more accessible and easy to quickly get your answers in a while that this is being built through notebook l it's probably replacing saas apps and the sales team are all using it yeah this is probably my favorite example because it's so accessible it's so easy to use and of course as you mentioned the podcast functionality well especially if you are a google workspace customer and like all of your company is using google tools already for work this is just like a very natural extension of that and like karen i think you're right there are people who were paying thirty forty fifty sixty grand a year for this type of functionality that was worse right you know like a year or two ago that is now just kinda like free and baked in to notebook l it's wild yeah i would say even way more than that oh yes like this is such a great free solution again if you are using google anyway and it's i think it's more powerful i agree that you could also do a version of this which is there's like seven or more different buyers and any b b buyer committee like above a certain average sale price and so you could imagine that if you're a company watching this like one of the things you could do is have a version of this but it's all for the different buyers like the sell points for those make sure the sales team have all that collateral roll you know the kind of pain points they have the solutions they have it's a great way to actually build enable for sales because they have the ability to chat with the data they have the ability to like have a audio overview they have the ability to turn it into a podcast and that's a postcard question it just like works for however you want to retrieve that information yeah one of the hardest things for sales is that they have so much information to use they're are just inundated they don't know where to go they don't have to worry about this here they just can quickly get the answers it's amazing yep well and it's very personalized was the point i was gonna make you know one of the things that if you're a regular watch for the show that we're hitting at is it's like ai is making kind of this one to one bespoke personalized experience finally real and that's both external two customers and prospects but it's also internal to your point rachel before a sales rep would have had to look through a bunch of kind of generic content and then like figured out how to shoe hornet it for a given prospect we're like they can just go to that notebook say here's the customer here's their problem find me somebody or tell me exactly what i should tell them whatever it may be and the ai is gonna give them a pretty good answer totally and they can even use the responses that we saw there throw it into gen park and get some awesome slides to show like there's just so many cool thing to do i'm a fan of gen spark that's a good one actually yeah you could just take all of that put it into gen spark and start to create presentations go first look so kip and eye showed you how to do that in gen spark okay so you're doing your position in and you have all of your team making sure they put the position in through the cloud project that is our representation of your customer has all the data so it's able to say like this is the way you speak to the customer turn the email into that turn the product page into that make sure everything is uniform which is actually really because in a lot of companies everything gets like different flavors of how people think who your customer is and so it all kind of sounds different your website sounds different your email signs is different then you have all these battle cars and notebook allowing that your sales team can use and make sure that you're speaking about competitors in the right way and we know how to win against competitors hey everyone we were right back to the show but first let me tell you about a podcast that i love it's podcast called digress it is hosted by my friend troy sand it's brought to you by the amazing hubspot podcast network the audio destination for anyone in business and i digress is great it's got thirty minute episodes and the podcast is all about helping you eliminate complexity complications and confusion in your business it's really heavy in frameworks and strategies to help you scale and sustain your success and you know recently troy had a really great episode it was called branding secrets leveraging style to change the narrative boost influence and profits and that was with his guest toy sweeney it's really good you to check it out and you can listen to that were all the episodes of eye digress anywhere you get your podcast what is another use case that you're using ai four so this is a new one we've been using but this is one where we're essentially doing customer interviews at scale using ai oh this is a clue actually i'm going to use this tool like we saved the best for last i did i i think this tool is so so so cool so this is a company called outs outset and i'm wanna show you how to create a study and some of the cool things that this can do so you can basically do video interviews using ai so in here you can essentially on your left hand side add different questions so you can add conversational multiple choice but i'm gonna use an example about what are your current wellness goals you're aiming to achieve please describe keep karen can solve them with ai wellness and that's what we hear for a wellness and nutrition well you're gonna get some cool information here but then you can choose your question type again and then there's different probing so you can say oh like only probe a couple times or you can say like probe a ton of times if you're not getting the right answer jesus are these real people you're gonna put into the abyss mode i don't wanna put it i hope someone never tries to put me into the abyss mode but rachel this people or is this a synthetic twin of people that's what i want everybody to try to understand so yeah so right now this is ai asking you questions mh but and like you're being given a video interview but it's more like an audio interview that you're being asked that a real person's being asked a real person yeah real person's being asked so like i as like the market researcher can interview hundreds there's of real customers without doing it myself right gets a game changer for any kind of growing company yeah right you can get very specific feedback there's a version of that that i think most people would say it would be a horrible version and i do agree but there is a version of that there there are companies that are able to build synthetic versions of your customer and they're are used within sales actually says sales sell to that synthetic version of your customer and it teaches new reps how to sell to your customer and you can program the customer to have different pushback i don't have the budget i don't have the time whatever it may be yeah and the sales rep tries to figure out how to navigate around that it records that and helps the sales rep you can coach the sales rep how to do better this you could actually build synthetic different versions of your customer and then have ai interview the ai representation of your customer correct that's what i think we'll have like a horrible future to think about i think that's what you were going i think that will happen and i think that is the abyss but no but in all seriousness imagine this does important for fair everybody understand we could do this right now mh right like we could go and rachel could do like some very detailed broad questions with fifty a hundred customers using this tool right and then we could go into chat and build digital twin versions based on all of that real life interview feedback for them and then do follow up questions that were just ai ai right exactly it's like a i'm in my own simulation really because this is like the perfect moment for me to start building products i was a software engineer way back in college and tried to be a software engineer for over years and now we've come full circle till i can build product with ai so i don't need to talk to humans i can build traditional ai representation for my customers and then have ai of interview ai so i don't have to talk to anyone there either so it's like the world is engineer humans out of the loop for me so i can just do all of these things about ever having to talk to someone one it's just incredible i wanna show you like an example of what this will actually look like for the customer but one thing i'm probing you can say exactly like make sure to ask about exercise goals eating habits and so it knows what to probe on which is very cool and one more thing i do have to show you is this language setting like look at all the languages you can do this in which is unbelievable like you're like me who can only speak english and but wanna get like that global sample you can do as many questions as you want but i'm just gonna do this one you're gonna get to hear about my exercise habits i love this i am looking to get more exercise do more workouts and eat better you see this is where the probing is coming in yes okay or wellness goals you're aiming to achieve please describe what they are i'm hoping to work out three times a week and rest of the time i'm gonna chase my kids that sounds like a great plan could you tell me more about the types of workouts you're they've used a clever hack here how often you they have a very well spoken english person conduct the interview there you go that's how you know you're gonna get better responses yeah except they should be using a better eleven labs model than that the voice quality isn't as as i would thought i love that balance of planned workouts and active time with your kids so i have two market researchers on my team we a ton of products a ton of needs and they're able to just do so many more customer interviews and then it also will run the analysis for you so this is something cool where if you have different questions you can then click in and get like a bunch of your like customer samples and these are like some of the best quotes that your customer said during the interviews they also have to have this highlight real at the end where they compile everything so not only is it doing the interviews but it's doing your analysis at the end as well it's just super cool and it's really helped us on the team have you found the engagement to be good like people are pretty happy talking to a an ai assistant yeah that's why i want to show how it was like it it's not a person that you know ai isn't in like it's very clear that you know ai interviewer so people are really engaging with it and we're getting great data at it and at scale so it's been really really great for the team how much more efficient is it rachel like because a lot of people watching this probably do an occasional survey but maybe they don't do really in interviews like this and they're really historically very manual in time consuming like so how much faster is it yeah here's the thing i think this is becoming more and more important because as we talked about with the quad projects and the custom gb you need more customer interviews and transcripts and if you you can't take the time to do like it might take wonderful full day you might be able to if you're lucky do ten interviews and i say if you're lucky because mh if deal with schedules and people not responding by email and not wanting to take all the time but this is able to do like hundreds in that period of time so i think it's saving a tremendous amount of time way faster yeah yeah i think the ability just to get data and use that data ai just speeds that up so much i wanted to give a close eye with one level of fun thing to show you to see if you think it's cooler or not not a show unless kieran show something he filled it follows a theme that kip and i have going on this show which is we kinda believe marketing is going to be much more tailored much more personalized i did a show last week was all around how to build these kind of micro audiences so you know the theory there is we build product marketing for an ideal customer profile that ideal customer profile has to be pretty broad because if it was like really really small we couldn't afford to hire that many marketers to market to these small audiences but with ai you can do that and so one of the interesting things that kinda think about is does product marketing actually become one of the teams that help you appear in because what l are really doing is looking to see all of the different ways people talk about your product right lots of niche ways and if you have content for that you're more likely to appear in l and so let me just give you a little like side by side competition i did here between o three and perplexed because complexity is my new like fun toy at the moment seems when you both like that bats and so what i basically did so what would be a micro audience for product marketing and well in this case it's like how would you divide up that ideal customer profile that you've been showing how you market to like that cloud project in this way we were doing it based upon people who has left reviews on g two or reviews on any review sites so we went out we took out a competitor and we said look at the reviews that are three stars or less across these platforms and then based upon the feedback that they give we're going to divide those up into a little audience and then we're gonna market create product position in for that audience based upon the problems they have in a house would solve them so this is a little example that it's like going across it's finding in the different reviewer roles it's talking about the pain points they have with this specific competitor that we have and then in caps letters you're ten times longer to complete anything people really have issues here because they caps things just doesn't save what you're working on meaning and you have to read redo things all the time price increase whereas they charge five x as much as the former basic plan blah no imitation in no emails about the sudden okay a lot of price stuff and so it cleans them right at crazy as little audience okay there's busy marketing professionals and small business owners who need efficient reliable tools to execute campaigns quickly at constant troubleshooting so this is like what i picked up on and people leaving negative reviews about that platform and then the job they have to be done because your point product marketing is really how do i market the benefits not the features the benefits of my product i need marketing automation to just work smoothly so i can focus on strategy not fighting with the software so what do we did here is we took this micro audience we paired it with your ideal customer profile and then based upon that we created a prompt that had you know how do you do great product position it it kinda goes and looks to see what are the best people in the world and what did they do really well then then comes back and says this is how you do it and then we give that prompt to lovable and i wanna show you the kinda two examples it did in love so you can see if you think that this is pretty good or not so this one was done by o three so again remember that it's doing the micro audience it's a smaller version of subset so it's the one who really struggled with the fact that the tool was not making them more productive so it has a pretty good like header here i thought like launch multi channel campaigns in minutes not days of duct tape is pretty good tools everything from first click to qualified leads live inside marketing hub and then i love the fact that it starts make up numbers i were some good fake return on investment stats grab the like a typical b2b b image here i look why is my day hijacked by marketing tools and then it will tell you why it's doing this right it surface is the productivity killer pain for dat to build awareness so this is again coming back to the micro audience talking about time drain data silos heavy enterprise suites so you can see what it's done here right it's crafted all of the content for your ic who has that specific cluster of problems and this is just one shot right i created this page in one shot like campaigns live before your next coffee all of the stuff you can do to get migrated all of the fake data around how you actually increase leads all of the stuff you can do around real time data attribution and so all on and on and on and on but like i thought for the very first attempt this was pretty good at bringing the product to live through a product page here i think it's good i think what you would have is you're gonna wanna dynamically spin this up for each individual company that has this problem exactly exactly that's the big thing they want people to take away this would be for a product page targeting that competitor and everyone who comes in through that competitor which you can get through data like you can actually once you have their domain you can actually figure out their tech stack it's so you would direct people change to this page which is specific to that pain points that people have around that but what i'm saying is we'd even render it for that specific company's pain so not just the competitor but the company who's using that competitor yeah the problem they have that's where you're gonna get real transformational conversion rate change the thing that's so cool see about that as i feel like years ago we tried to do something even with kept to your point with company names on such a smaller scale but it was just impossible and now you totally do this and it's it's even better than what we were doing manually it's just so cool so you you're right kip so basically you're saying take this first row which is a company who will have a review that is one or two stars yep and they were like everything taken ten times longer to complete anything you yes we're gonna pair their words back to them we build the page for these exactly we actually have an agent that dynamically those campaigns per exactly i think that's actually something we should do i think we can do that i this is what i thought we were doing we and i talking after this but like that's what's gonna be the whole thing the whole thing is going to be understanding that pain that the swift company has and then activating it on a personal web page a personal ad personal email to the point where you're like this is exactly how we can solve it for you and why it's so good for you and that's how you're gonna transform conversion rates in a world where website visitors are much harder you get right well the cool thing i think about product marketing role here is it's becoming more and more important because you have all these pages you have to have that consistency and messaging voice and now product marketers for the first time have the ability to do that at scale which they've never had before so it's just pull out the illusion of product marketing role just be way more tailored so perplexed right similar like it's all our around productivity not a great i think above the full experience here what do you notice about per compared to the o three one right off the bat what don't you see here and then what do you see lots of here something that the older models do emojis i was gonna say it's a lot of text different and then yes the older models love emoji love a good emoji o three move past emojis it's graduated it's got a little bit older it said you know i've grown out of my emoji phase i have to grow up i'm not allowed to do that anymore for pe he's like no i'm still into this emoji phase it's pretty good but yeah it's you know has hidden cost of broken automation that picked up on one of the reviews that talked about that so this automation doesn't work gives you some stats makes the platform that just works so again i just shows you how quickly you can go from your ic and then some additional data to actually pretty good for shot of like product mark on collateral yeah so the main thing here is just the amount of tailoring and personalization you can do because of ai tools is just like different from anything you could have done in the past we're gonna do a whole taylor episode campaign like coming up karen because you and i are cook on a bunch of stuff here but i think what is dramatic to me about the show today is that product marketing is i think more important than ever first of all especially because how ai is changing especially the technology market product and feature comm customizations happening much faster so the store you're telling and your ability to articulate the pain and value matters much more so that's one thing that's happening two there's great product market fit with these ai tools and product marketing there's really cool use cases rachel that you showed us that literally anyone can go out and do for like zero to twenty dollars a month right you're not although you're not talking like hundreds or thousands of dollars a month and the third thing is it's clearly going to get way more personal and we'll be continued to be talking about that on upcoming shows rachel karen what else would you wanna add before we close out today's episode i think if you're a product marketer you absolutely absolutely have to spend time using these tools find the time lock off your calendar you get deep into them it will make you so much better at your job and allow you to do so much more than you ever thought was possible try to find your unlock i found my unlock and that it led to all these other things and i just can't imagine my life without it awesome i think this is a great show for any companies that even don't have product marketing teams just wanna do better position and wanna do better competitive insights wanna a one shot of page to be tailored to their audience you have practical use cases that is what we try to do in this show and until next episode we will see all them see everybody

alright hey everyone we're here today checking out a new ai video model that's come out from hayley and i'm gonna show you an example of a cool video that somebody made with this model kinda shows you what it's good at what's possible gonna walk you through chat on how to build a really good prompt and script for an ai video then we're gonna go to the tool and see how good it is at actually generating a video from that script and that's gonna be the show talk about how you might be using this new model and these types of videos in your business and in your marketing let's get into today's show before we get into today's show here's a quick word from hubspot cutting your sales cycle in half sounds pretty incredible but that's exactly what sandler training did with hubspot they used breeds hubspot ai tools to tailor every customer interaction without losing their personal touch and the results were pretty incredible click through rates jumped twenty five percent qualified leads quadrupled and people spent three times longer on their landing pages go to hubspot dot com to see how breeze can help your business grow hey everyone we got another ai video show free today we're talking all about ai video partially just because i've been captivated and i mean captivated by ai video recently because people are making really fun and creative stuff and without a doubt my number one is the cat olympics if you've not seen this yet this is an ai generated video of different types of cats doing olympic dives and i honestly i just can't get enough of it the balancing the approach into the water i like this backwards one it's so good and i think it shows off that like wow that's a hard thing to just generate with ai to get the physics and everything of that to actually work there's an audience in the background it's pretty funny and so gentleman named pablo created this pablo prompt i'm sure his name not pablo but that's what i got pablo so there you go and he made this and it's gotten like a million and a half views and he made it thanks to a new model from halo called the halo two model anytime there's a new model i like to like share it with you put it through the paces kinda like to see what's happening here right so that's exactly what i did most ai video right now is just like it's good at creating a decent clip that you could maybe stitch a few of them together and maybe have a video and i think that's what happened in this cat video but i'm gonna show you why i think that in a second but you still need a good prompt and the better the prompt the better the output you're gonna get so when i do the experiments i tend to always have the prompt written in chat jb then take that prompt into whichever video tool that i want to use at the time and so where i started just like hey i just want a fifteen second ad spot for hubspot custom agent product it's the thing i use if you haven't used subs hubspot custom agent you should go check it out every business should be using it and i haven't do some type of video or ad related to it and it's like can you make a fifteen second ad spot as if it was directed by james cameron detailed outline visual direction setting characters the works and i will tell you o three is getting very good at these types of outlines and directions so gave this very detailed outline unfortunately i've yet to find a video tool that can handle this type of outline and put together essentially different types of prompts together into one video i think i could go through and do a lot of this like clip by a clip and edit that together and that's probably another show in the future but what i wanna to do is just give you a quick hit show today of like if you have something that you want to communicate and you can get a real detailed outline and you put it in a modern video tool what do you get today because this is like the real practical brass tacks of all this so this is he it is one of the mini video ai models that are out right now there are some certain kind of styles and aesthetics to these videos the quality is pretty cool and so what you need to do is you can go down to video and you can then add an image and they'll turn that image into video you can have a subject reference and you can like reference a character or create a character or you can do what i did which was text to video which is put in that text based prompt from chat one of the problems i have had is that the context windows the size of the prompt you can put in to create these videos is very small so far one of the things i wanna give props to halo for is it is had one of the longer video context windows that i have found it i was able to put a full prompt that whole prompt from chat for the fifteen second spot in here it did reach the max this is the level of detail you can get let's talk ai strategy because having the tools is one thing but knowing how to use them together that's the game changer the top players have nailed this and we've mapped it out for you in a no fluff guide featuring forty plus ai tools and structured a process to build your own ai toolkit grab the guide and transform how you use ai the link is in the description below now let's get back to today's show and so now what did it actually do because i thought it was a decent prompt this is what you get you get a pan in nice swivel on a steady cam you get a shipping delay you get this underwater creature you get the beginning of what looks like a orange hubspot sting ray or mater ray coming to save of the day after this shipping delay issue and then your clip ends the challenge with all of these tools is that they're really good at like six to eight second clips and that's why that cat works so well because each video of the cat on the diving board is like a six to eight second per clip and that guy had to go and cut them together right where ai video is at today is that you really have to have video editing skills if you have a cool script and you can break it down into like two to eight second chunks and you can go and have consistent prompting you could get pretty good video output but you're gonna to have to connect them together and edit them together make the transitions add in any after effects and animation that you want to have happen so what's the good of it right now is that you can save a bunch of money because you don't have to go do an expensive video and that saves you a lot of time and money but it's not good enough yet that if you are a non technical video person that you can go in and just say hey this is the i wanna try today and it's gonna spin up that video that video within one or a couple tries is gonna be pretty good and be something you could go ron on youtube or instagram or one of the online video sites right and so that's where we are today the video quality has gotten way better if you've got some know how i think you could make some good ai videos but it's not ready to just go and make a quick ad so fit was me and i was out there and i was like hey i want to do more videos whether they'd be trying to make viral videos video ads whatever and i wanna do those with ai what i would do and i'd probably make a custom gp in chat gp i would get really good at generating really great scripts for like six second video clips and then i would use those scripts in something like heal something like google's v three to generate the actual video clips and then i would use an adobe product or one of the mini video editing products to go out there and clip those things together and that's how you're gonna have to edit it and make that work today you can do it much faster much cheaper than you can with traditional video shoots but it's still gonna require some some leg work to really get it right so i hope this was helpful i hope this is a new tool if you've used this tool or you're using for the first time i'd love to see any videos anybody makes would love to check them out hopefully on a future show we'll actually take some of these models and do like a big compare or we'll actually stitch some of them together and see what the best ai generated kind of ad that you can create today what that's gonna look like so that is the show today thank you so much for watching we'll see you real soon on marking against the grain

the great content collapses underway i'm gonna give you some of the most jaw drop in stats from a talk to ceo of cla give recently just about how quickly visits and clicks are drying up to content publishers websites and really what it means for the future of marketing and growth let's get into this quick reaction video from some of the most incredible stats that you will get this week on just how quickly the entire shape of the internet is changing because of ai we're right back to today's show first i gotta tell you about a week that you're not gonna wanna miss it is a highlight of my year every year it is in mail which is hubspot annual event where we bring together the best attendees is the best speakers the best experts in sales and marketing customer success in ai i and we all learn together and we all figure out how to grow our businesses better in the coming year and this year it's no exception it's a fire lineup it's gonna be at the moscow center in san francisco california september third through the fifth so it's a great way to kinda close out q three and kick off q four really strong and have your heads right for twenty twenty six because you're gonna learn and hear from amy poe da ama mod of ant philanthropic dark patel sean evans from hot ones marquis brown league glenn and doyle and the world's best speakers and experts across marketing sales customer service ai they are all at about hundreds of amazing sessions and you know it's more than just the sessions it's about the networking it's about learning from your fellow attendees your peers understanding what people are doing really well where people are getting stuck that is how you break out that is how you are going to grow better and faster in twenty twenty six you're not gonna wanna miss it you can go to inbound dot com slash register to secure your ticket and your spot for inbound twenty twenty five okay so this is a quick video from the ceo of cloud fair and i thought this was some of the most important data that has been shared recently so we're gonna get into it right here and we're gonna play some of the video and i'm gonna stop the video and na this as we go along but like that's just have a listen to what that's metric with we found to describe how much harder your business is a as a media creator as a content creator gun is to look at just google data how many pages did google scrape in exchange for how many visitors did they say i think that's a good way to think about the value creation of the internet the way kinda of google built its business with content publishers is this somewhat partnership right they you know unspoken partnership that we scrape your content and in return for us scraping your content we give you traffic back and that's why all of this actually works so that kind of visit to scrape ratio is a good way to think about how the internet actually works today google is responsible for i think sixty seven percent of all referral traffic across the internet so every website is somewhat reliant on google website traffic google search with you is you gave them your content they took all snippets of it described it and in exchange they sent you traffic for every two pages they scraped they sent you one visitor on average across the entire internet we have really good data they scraped two pieces of your content and they give you a visit back that's a pretty good partnership what has changed over that period of time over the next ten years up until six months ago we've added two billion people to the internet we went from four billion to six billion people using the internet so that should be good for you as a content creator billion more people to read your content so wow this should be good for all of us who create content we should begin in many more visitors to our website the google crawl rate has not changed at all it's been remarkably consistent over that entire time and so if you just had those two facts you would actually think that for every scrape you would have gotten more visitors but you all know that's not what's happened how much harder did it get over the last ten years to be a publisher and i've asked that to a bunch of people and the answer is it's about three times harder and that blends up exactly with the data so i think there's a couple of quick points here so two billion more people have come on to the internet google are stole crawling in the same way so their crawling and all this data but six months ago they would take six pages and give you a visit back so we have gone from two pages to one visit to six months ago six pages from one visit the way you hear what's happened seventy five percent actually not now six months ago seventy five percent of queries to google get answered on google which means that if you an original content creator your information is getting summarized and then sold because they still put ads there but you don't get that traffic enabled and that's the good news because what's happened in the last six months the answer is that in the last six months it has gotten even harder than it did even over the last previous ten years and so the traffic ratio now is for every eighteen pages that google takes from you you get one visitor pretty incredible when you think about it right seventy five percent of all of the questions that people are asking google get answered on their website where they are able to monetize off ads and they publishers who are creating all this content get nothing get nothing in return now they used to get visits right keep about standing your mind they used to get one visit for every six pages scraped three times worse in six months and what change we can track this on region by region by region by region the answer is ai overview where they're taking your content and someone else's content someone else's content they're smashing it all together they're giving you an answer right there and i bet that the answer today is that ninety percent of queries to google have answer without people clicking on a single link how incredible is that we started at ten years ago two pages for one visit that it didn't really change that much up until about six months ago we had three times where six pages were scraped and they give you a visit back what has happened in the past six months is incredible we are now at the point in google we're gonna get into opening when do stay tuned for opening a eye because the stats there are off the wall google are giving you one visit for every eighteen pages great because of ai overview and we're gonna go from around seventy five percent of all of the questions being answered on google to ninety percent so google is basically just monetize in other people's content and taken the ability to monetize that content away from that publisher that is not good for the future health of the web right the way the web has been built is there's is this value exchange we create content you give us visitors and we can monetize some of those visitors and you can monetize some of the content and that has fundamentally been how the internet has worked to date now that's google where we are today is ai reviews are being rolled at much more aggressively i think over thirty five percent of all search trigger an ai overview google are starting to beta test ai mode in the us and recently india they say that's gonna be the default mode so this is going to accelerate very very rapidly but let's get into some of the other data how does this work for open ai because i think that's something we all have an interest in open is become one of the d facto search engines when you want to use an ai assistant to search so what does the data look like for open ai what's the ratio for open ai six months ago two hundred and fifty to one what is it today fifteen hundred to one what's changed people trust the ai more over the last six months which means they're not reading original content and so that means those three things go away i just want to give a quick call out to myself here as soon as i use chat you can go all the way back to the very first episode that we covered in november after it had launched i literally said this would happen humans will always default to easy and fast every single time and i talked about the fact that eventually humans will become very comfortable using an ai assistance to get questions and a lot of the feedback i got as i'm wrong people would not trust ai they would not query ai because they were understood at hall they wouldn't trust it they would always default to the blue links and i just didn't believe that to be true because the very first time i used chat t i could see it was gonna be a much better experience than actually me having to go to the blue an and mindless information myself and that is exactly what's happened in open ai was already tough enough two hundred and fifty pages for one visit and google has gone pretty bad over the past six months but that's stole around eighteen pages scraped for one visit open two hundred and fifty pages scraped they give you one visit what's happened today fifteen hundred pages scraped one visit because people are very comfortable getting their answers through an ai assistant because we just become more used to that experience we trust it more we believe that hey it sure fine as long as it's easier and it's faster i'm always gonna default to that experience and that is fundamentally going to break the way the internet works today and so if you believe that the business model of original content creation is driving visitors to that content i just have a really bad story for you which is the future of the web is going to be more and more like ai and that means that people are gonna be reading the summaries of your content not the original content and what i'm worried about why i'm wearing black today is i don't know if you can't sell subscriptions and you just can't sell ads and you don't get an ego hit from knowing the people are consuming your stuff why anyone's gonna create content for someone who's created a content their entire time they've actually been on the web have always enjoyed creating content i think that is a sad thing for all of us to consider by one of the potential outcomes of ai it's breaking the relationship between the person the publisher and the engines who actually rely on that content to monetize at the ag and i do think that is going to be problematic and it's really problematic for marketers because let's submit it most of the scalable marketing models that we built today google search has been at the heart of that but it's not just that right let's actually play out what's going to happen and i think if you kinda play out the last two years it basically maps to what we said when we first experience chat so i think we have some sort of history of being mostly right here and i think what is going to happen is search traffic is going to die out people are going to gravitate towards ai assistance on those ai assistance we're going to actually look at share a voice which is a brand metric we're gonna just look to see how many impressions our brand got within those ai assistance which is nowhere near as good as being able to track a click a visit a customer but it's not just that what will happen is people have to try to build scalable models somewhere scalable models forecast models are what if i do these things i can equate that to about ten twenty thirty customers a month and so what we'll do is let's start to gravitate much more towards paid advertising because we are not able to do it in an inorganic way right social platforms are locking down their platforms to promotional content if you use links or you use promotional content in your social post you usually get less and less engagement they're becoming closed walls google does now becoming a closed world platform where they wanna keep people on their platform these ai assistants are closed walls they for the most part wanna keep you in their platform and they do a great job of that and so we gravitate towards paid advertising the cost of paid advertising is going to go up and up and up because there's going to be more and more competition and that is going to be une economical for a lot of businesses how do we actually do that and so i do think the way that we market is going to drastically change because the way you market is really predicated on the way platforms work ag work internet consumer behavior works you actually have to market into those things and those things are rapidly rapidly changing and in the way we've really never seen before maybe since the internet itself started to become popular and we gravitate it towards offline marketing to online marketing but we are going to rewrite the ways that we have done marketing and i think this is a time to really stay curious on top of the data be watching shows like marketing against a grain because we are trying to give you the net new mark playbook right last week we published a new playbook all about micro audience target in which is how ai can allow us to be more proactive go and reach people not wake for the click actually divide people into small audiences and create personalized tailored marketing experiences for them to proactively pull them in versus waiting for them to click on something that you created so that is the stats to give that summary google ten years ago two pages scraped one visit six months ago six pages scraped one visit today because of ai overview eighteen pages scraped one visit so in ten years we've gone nine times harder to get traffic and ai mode is only just being rolled out now and then open ai which has become the d factor facto ai assistant search platform we were at about two hundred and fifty pages scraped to one visit now fifteen hundred pages scraped to one visit because people trust ai assistance and he even said and called its sixty thousand pages scraped to one visit people stay within those platforms this is the most sizable shift in the way that we market and grow businesses that has probably ever happened and everything is going to be rewrote over the next six to twelve to eighteen months that's the episode subscribe to mark and us grain and if you want all of the new future mark and playbook as we find them as we start to build an night we will give them to you

we know that marketing is changing we know that google search traffic is disappearing but no one has given us the new marketing in playbook while i am deep in the labs and i really do mean that i'm deep in complexity labs and what i'm gonna show you is a potential new marketing and playbook that can create you at bunch of money using just per complexity labs i'm gonna show you how we can turn per complexity labs into an incredible marketing colleague that can actually help you track more money from your audience and who wouldn't wanna do that be right back to today's show first i gotta tell you about a week that you're not gonna wanna miss it is a highlight of my year over year it is inbound which is hubspot annual event what we bring together the best attendees is the best speakers the best experts in sales and marketing customer success in i and we all learn together and we all figure out how to grow our businesses better in the coming year and this year it's no exception it's to fire lineup it's gonna be at the moscow center in san francisco california september third through the fifth so it's a great way to kinda close out q three and kick off q four really strong and have your heads right for twenty twenty six because you're gonna learn and hear from amy poe da ama mod of ant philanthropic dark patel sean evans from hot ones marquis brown league glenn and doyle and world's best speakers and experts across marketing sales customer service ai they are all at inbound hundreds of amazing sessions and you know it's more than just the sessions it's about the networking it's about learning from your fellow attendees your peers understanding what people are doing really well where people are getting stuck that is how you break out that is how you are going to grow better and faster in twenty twenty six you're not gonna wanna miss it you can go to inbound dot com slash register to secure your ticket and your spot for inbound twenty twenty five right so we have not focus that much on complexity labs on this podcast youtube channel to date that's all gonna change i'm kind of obsessed with complexity labs and what i wanna do is show you a potential new marketing playbook that i believe is gonna be one of these staples of how we do marketing in the future we're gonna do it all through complexity labs with a little help from claude we've got three core steps and it's all really focused around how i believe we are gonna change from marketing two a broad set of people which we generally call in b2b marketing and your ic your ideal customer profile who is the ideal customer that would actually buy your products and services and this is a petition representation of your customer and usually includes a broad swath of people who could all have some sort of interest in your product or service because it solves a core pain point for them that typically has how we do marketing them and we create content for them we create ads for them and it's quite broad because we have to hire a bunch of marketers to market to that audience now the thing that ai allows you to do is to market to what i call micro versions of that audience in a more personalized way and i think this is a very new thing for marketing because ai empowers us to actually scale beyond what we've been able to do in the past so this concept is really all around how we can do micro audience marketing and how we can do all of this through tools like per complexity labs so what is a micro audience let me show you this is an example of a micro audience and we are going to build this using cloth to build a version of your ideal customer profile so basically your ic which has being a staple of marketing forever but i wanna give you a cloud prompt that that can build that for you if you don't have it because you need it to do micro audience marketing so your ideal customer profile that's one prompt you're gonna get that then i'm gonna give you a pretty killer prompt that you're going to use in complexity labs to turn your ic your ideal customer profile into a bunch of micro audiences like this they're going to give you an intense signal and i'm gonna talk a little bit about intense signals i call them hunts and i'm gonna tell you why i call them hunts but they're like a way that you can actually segment your ic your ideal customer profile into many smaller audiences that allow you to do more custom and tailored marketing and more creative things to that audience it talks about their pain points it gives you their core hook which in this case is the reason they would buy hubspot and then it gives me some suggested campaigns we're gonna take all that that information and then pass that to another protects the lab prompts to be able to actually create your marketing collateral to market to these micro audiences now what is per complexity labs per complexity labs is like a work bench version of per complexity you have to be a per complexity pro user and it allows you to actually do kinda multi chain prompts and so the assistant is able to do things like i crawled the web and then research a pdf and then write some code to do something all to give you back your response and i'm gonna show you that in action so it's kinda like a level marketing team working for you when you wanna do the kind of stuff that i'm gonna show you can do lots of or different tasks all from a singular prompt and it's pretty cool ux right i can create these things called spaces which are really projects and chat i create a space i say this is bill hunter and micro audiences i'm gonna tell you what the hunters is i've copied around all of this stuff so you do not start copying and branding my stuff this is all my stuff i'm only joking about that feel free to so i call it hunt these are my previous ones that we're gonna get into here i was running one just right before we went on this pod to make sure it was working and really good and so let's get into the three steps right we wanna get to hey i wanna get to my micro audience and then i wanna mark to that micro audience and i want to see why this so much better and gonna create me a lot of money because that's what we are here to do as marketers to create those sales so i actually have started to put these into google docs again there's nothing that intuitive about an ic and an ideal customer profile you should all have them i do wanna show that the tools like cloud now and open are really good for building these or even just refining what you have over time because it has access to your internal tools and i compare that with external data and so what this one here does is basically say okay we're gonna build an ideal customer profile for hubspot and we're going to use internal data so you can see here i'm using google drive i'm telling that to pull doc with a seed list here which is a customer persona win rate case study any of these things that exist in the file name or title prioritize the ten most recently edited files because you want them to be most up to date then i look at external resources it's things like analyst reports things like linkedin jobs things like tech stacks things like funding signals things like community pains i have a couple of little like special sauce things in here right linkedin jobs past ninety days the kind of tech stack only ones with fifty reviews kind of the set reddit these kind of community threads that are only in the last twelve months and then it does a little little stuff here that i won't get into to explain because it would taking me for a little more time but it does seem like figure an night of what are these external sources are the most important how to stock rank those and then it gives me this output format right and it basically says hey company product snapshot the core persona what are their success metrics whether they're typical of pain points what competitors do they use what are differentiator what are exclusion flags like you think people that you definitely do not wanna market because our outside of your ic bunch of things like that you could see if i run it in again if you get this we'll share this for sure as part of this episode you'll get it in the comments if you wanna run that you can change it again to your taste the everything i share is not meant to be for copy and paste they meant to be for building and blocks so you kind of copy them edit them build on top of them i think of ai in some ways like lego blocks and so you copy the things that look good and then you edit refined to your needs and so you can see here it's created this ic piece where it ran across three hundred and twenty four sources internal and external and then would create me this and basically talks about who is an ic for hubspot crm and so it goes through the company and the product snapshot the core buyer persona the known success metrics and these are important for the hunt we're about to do to create a micro audience the typical pains the competitors the differentiator like how you can differentiate for this audience things like ai powered automation things like all in one platform who we have that awesome and that's like really true we win a lot because of the all in one exclusion flags i think this is wrong so i would refine that we have lots of great companies ten less employees industries that require on premise deployment pretty true so you can see here it's like got some stuff in here that heavy salesforce customization old salesforce is heavy customization so you can see this got some pretty good exclusion flags so we've got an ic right i thought there's is like this feature is so boring but i just love it that you can save all of this to a pdf and now we are going to go and say okay well we would typically go then build marketing around this ideal customer profile typically some email all of these different things and again it's because you need to have a broad enough audience then it makes sense to hire marketers to market to them and ai changes that ai allows you to have a huge marketing team without haven't hired a lot of marketers and so you could break down these audiences into micro audiences now we're gonna get into their per complexity labs prompt and so what am i doing here i wanna describe the prompt a little bit so basically what the prompt is doing is it's creating a assistant that's my micro audience hunter and marketer copyright current flanagan it's going to input the ic remember our ic is the ideal customer pro file and then it is going to output these micro audience cards that we able to just input in to another assistant to run campaigns now what it's doing here and i'm gonna try to explain this really simply because of this is gonna show you the value of per labs it's gonna do a bunch of different things all chain together first of all it parse the document it parse this pdf that we give it and basically looks for that baseline kpis this is going to be important so what is a baseline kpi let me explain the thought process pure and you can do whatever would work for you what i have is the known success metrics like these are the things that are ideal customer profile is usually responsible for and so for us it's always going to be things like pipeline velocity grow the sales team grow revenue all of these different things now one of the things i could do is create micro audiences around our known kpis at micro audience that's going to be clustered around people who want to grow revenue who want to generate more pipeline who want to improve the productivity of the sales team whatever it may be and so i just wanna make the distinction here i am purposely going after new ryzen phrases things that we would not have thought of before that are going to be in these linkedin job ads and i'm gonna show you so i'm gonna explain how that is if it sounds like what does he mean here don't worry i'm gonna quickly explain that so basically it parse i the kpis here parse out the buyer rolls right we have core buyer rules in here as well it parse out the buyer rules in the section two core buyer persona parse out the category words in section one it parse out the market tier and then differentiator differentiator is pretty important it's number six it's how you can differentiate for this audience so it's parse at this information and it has that information here nah this is the important part this is a hunt how are we going to start to categorize folks into different clusters and again i have twenty different hunts this as just one example of how you can do it based upon kpi key phrases and what it's going to do is it's going to go and look on linkedin folks it's going to look for people that are part of your category words which are what we are in section one the kind of company and product snapshot it's going to look for buyer rules so companies that are hiring these buyer rules these job titles that we got here if we can find companies that are higher and for people who would use hubspot that is a great audience to market to because we know they are looking to move the needle on things at hubspot can move the needle on i'm looking to hire people that would use hubspot but the cool thing it's doing to create the micro audience is it's looking for kpi phrases that are specifically not in the baseline kpis these are the kpis that we know our ic is generally in charge of and so we would usually always market to these folks but micro audiences are how i can create smaller versions of my audience a market to them in more custom and tailored ways in this example what it's doing is looking for mentions of new metrics they're accountable for that we may not have seen before right and so how it does this is it says okay well i'm starting to see this new metric these job ads are saying that isn't mentioned in your baseline kpis and what i'm gonna do is cluster companies by the metric so if a bunch of companies are advertising jobs against this new metric i cluster all of them together and then i have a simple score that is an intent and fifth score and the intent is basically cluster companies together in groups and so if five of more companies all have to same metrics they're in my high tier group hyphen intent group because we found a new metric that lots of companies are talking about and that is top of the group for me to wanna go out and create some tailored marking towards and the fit is basically you know are they and smb mid market it's just employee count pretty self explanatory so to just recap on that what are we doing here we are basically taking our ideal customer profile then we are looking for companies that are advertising for our ideal job titles like within that customer profile and you can see that here the core buyer persona has different job titles so there's a bunch of different job titles that going there we're looking for companies that are higher in those job titles and then we're specifically focusing on the kpi part to create micro audiences we are saying hey we want to know what new kpis these people are being held accountable for and i want you to split them into groups by the mention of that new kpi and the group of companies that are all mentioned in the same kpi together that's gonna be high intent because that is a real one we wanna pay attention to there's obviously something happened there they are all talking about these new metric and then there's a slide in scale so maybe only two companies are talking about this metric so that's like less intent and then we have fit and then it outputs into this micro audience right it has a micro audience card format and so you can see here i'd describe it into the catchy name because you need a marketing name you have a signal you have a pain and you have a hook and you have a suggested marketing and campaign that you'll run to them and so i ran this one and you can see it ran for some time it went through a bunch of data and it started to pull back a bunch of things for us and i thought some of them were really cool these pipeline velocity optimize three mid market companies posted job ads in the last forty five days i'm gonna talk a little bit about this forty five days so that's important and how you can actually move the range in terms of how many companies you wanna come back and they talked about lead prioritization and pipeline velocity i'm grinding an un qualified leads on my sales pipeline moves to slowly cause and missed revenue targets and so it has a hook on how we can solve that and then it has a suggested campaign talks about fit and intent intent is obviously three out of five because it's only three companies mentioned that and that's because i've got pretty stringent parameters on how it's going to actually pull back companies it talks about conversion rate and maximize so three and smb mid market companies posted job ads in the last forty five days mentioned in lead qualification and conversion optimization and we talk about the pain we talk about the hook and then we have a suggested campaign for them i'm all on the on attribution analytics seekers so you can see it's done this micro audience it started to create micro audiences around these new ryzen kpis that people are being held accountable for everyone if you're like me you love learning from the best and you just love learning period and a podcast that is all about learning is one that i love it's called billion dollar moves it's hosted by sarah chen spellings it's brought to you by hubspot media and sarah is awesome and she covers really what it takes to build a remarkable business she's a venture capitalist she's a strategist she has really hard questions and wants to find the highs and the lows from the most successful builders and entrepreneurs of our time so that we can learn from them and make our own billion dollar moves she's got a great episode around the big bet mindset and how you really build bold change for your company it's awesome you're wanna check that out as well as all reps that's it's awesome highly recommend you can listen to billion dollar moves wherever you get your podcast and so that's how we create these kind of micro audiences now i have a bunch of micro audiences around a single hunt so a hunt in this cases go look at job ads and use kpis to break apart audiences i'm gonna give you an example of another hunt to show you there's an infinite number of ways that you can actually do this and so what do we do then well then we actually just want to create a marketing and kit for that audience audiences and so you can see here we're going to use per complexity labs again and we have a multi channel campaign kit so we have the cluster name we have the top kpi so we're gonna go after one of the micro audiences we're gonna go after the very top one because that has the best fit and intent as a reminder that is micro audience pipeline velocity optimize and we are going to go after this one and create a campaign around it so we have our cluster name and we have what is the top kpis so remember this was the ryzen kpi that was not in our baseline of kpis we have cluster which is only three mid market companies i'm gonna show you how you can make this many many more we talk about the core pain we talk about the hook we talk about the cta book up pipeline velocity assessment and then you can see here we tell per complexity to create a snapshot using firmer graphics the tech stack overlap one line common pain summary so it does like a little cluster snapshot of the micro audience talk a little bit about the target csv then this is the meat of it which is the campaign assets so you can change this out for what would work for you and this is just an example we're showing it will create a linkedin carousel it will create a email sequence it will create a landing page wireframe because we can hypo in the future that you will create micro sites for all of your micro audiences right each one of them will come to our website specifically designed for that micro audience need and then we're gonna create a thirty second video script in linkedin or tiktok we can ask it to recommend budget and tell us how you do this give it a little bit of format and so in that way i simply pass my micro audience to complexity labs and because it's able to stitch all of these things together it starts to run that campaign for me so talks about the cluster snapshot it says they on average have two hundred and fifty to three hundred fifty average head count headquarters are in tech ford regions like they're in new york dallas houston primarily b funding because we went and asked to go to crunch base look at this tech overlap salesforce crm considering alternatives hubspot mark and hub outreach sales loft so we can get started to get an idea of their tech slack common pain which is pretty cool this is your target see here this is actually for uploading into ad platforms and so you can upload a csv of companies to target i think it's three hundred so this is just again for demo purposes these are your campaign assets so it creates your different linkedin carousel ads now what i would say is if i was doing this for real real as a little tip for you all i would have a separate prompt per campaign asset when you try to stitch in multiple asks like create this asset this asset and this asset and will not do a good job creating the assets is a whole other show i wanna give you an example of how you use a micro audience with ai to create a full campaign but while i will do is come back and show you how i create the campaign and up level what you see here because i would actually have a specific prompt per campaign asset but along with a style how to create something pretty amazing it still does a pretty good job creates the linkedin carousel has card one car two car three talks about your pain point understands the cluster understands how to market to them creates a quick email sequence that you can send to these companies again because this is a micro audience and pretty targeted this case there's only like three companies in it but i'm show you how you can actually increase that the landing and page wireframe is just for illustration purposes that you could actually have a build out prompt to actually create a micro site for each micro audience so you can imagine you would direct each micro audience to a specific site just for them and because you can use tools like rep lovable all of these tools to easily create websites it can make a lot of sense with ai ai whereas before it wouldn't have and then you can actually create this video script and if i was doing this i would create a video script plug it into v three and i would have my video assets for these micro audiences so this is an example where i take a micro audience card i can plug it into an ai assistant perplexed labs in this one shot prompt did a pretty good example i'll come back with another episode and show you how you can use a micro audience and have a campaign agent probably do something maybe much better than you see on this screen because i'm gonna teach it how to do each individual campaign asset but again i think if i'm starting night when i wanna start to create some real revenue for my company this is good enough for me to actually start to go and do some stuff for recommends how you use your budget again this is for illustration purposes you can actually put some stuff in here around context of your company what is my budget all of that stuff will actually help it give you some better recommendations now why do i keep saying pay attention to the forty five days because if i want to change broad this will go i have basically ruled that it's looking for companies that have posted on linkedin in the last forty five days those was job so you could obviously go back ninety days a hundred and eighty days a whole year it would actually give you a lot more companies and then you could actually change your seed list right the amount of kpi key phrases you could actually tell it to return the new kpi seed list and i've done that and basically say hey like me all of the new ones that you found and then i look at them and i basically say to them okay take that seed list and go ahead and find another like fifteen twenty kpis in these job ads that would fit into that cluster of seed phrases so i could go then from like fifteen kpis to thirty to forty five to sixty the uk phrases the more companies it can go after that has mentioned those and clustered them together and say hey here's a new phrase was mentioned by two companies here's another one that was mentioned by three here's another one mentioned by four here's another one mentioned by five or twenty companies right and so you can go after more companies in that way so the number of days since the job out has been posted and the number of key phrases in that seed list these kind of kpis so to give you a quick example this is only one right so again micro audiences one you could have hundreds and so this is another example which i call kind of stack synergy signals and what it would do is find firms that have two complementary tools that say i know that companies that use hubspot have cal and slack but no hubspot i could use that to do a micro audience on just companies that have colleen slack a new hubspot and this year would go out and start to create that micro audience for me and the reason you do this is because you can start to tailor all of your marketing in more specifically for that micro audience so for me if i know that these people they are charge of these getting kpis that we don't really market to today we don't say hey we can help you do a b or c we're talking about a bunch of other kpis that our audience have had forever we're able to tailor our content to say we can help you with those kpis i'm able to tailor my art to say helps hubspot and help you with those kpis i'm able to create much more video content for them to show how we would help with those kpis and so again this is the beauty of micro audiences is because of ai because i can have perplexed go create the micro audiences because i can have ai start to create all the campaign assets for the micro audiences i can actually go out and do much more tailored marketing at scale so instead of having an ai replace the human and create the video asset for me i can have human plus ai create a hundred videos for a hundred micro audiences versus how it works today create one video for a broad ie your ideal customer profiles your ideal customer profile is your foundational audience and you break that into micro audiences and then you use ai to personalize your marketing into those micro audiences hopefully this illustrates a couple of things there is going to be new ways of doing marketing in that ai is going to enable it shows you some of the awesome around complexity labs and will show you more in future shows because i love it and trying to give you solutions not problems yes we know search being disrupted but hey there's a ton of upside all of the things that we kind start to do with ai so that's this episode of marketing against grain i hope you enjoyed it i hope it wasn't too hard to follow i did try to dis steal it down make it as simple as i could and if you like these kind of new playbook believe me deepen the lab there's a lot more to come so do stay tuned and subscribe to that channel

hey everybody ai video has gone from gimmick to the big time and that's what we're gonna talk about today we're gonna show you a real live ad that was made in two days just using ai created video clips and that's pretty incredible considering how bad ai video was even just a year ago we're gonna show you some crazy examples let's get to today's show we'll be right back to today's show first i gotta tell you about a week that you're not gonna wanna miss it is a highlight of my year over year it is in mail which is hubspot annual event what we bring together the best attendees is the best speakers the best experts in sales in marketing customer success in ai and we all learn together and we all figure out how to grow our businesses better in the coming year and this year it's no exception it's a fire lineup it's gonna be at the moscow center in san francisco california september third through the fifth so it's a great way to kinda close out q three and kick off q four really strong and have your heads right for twenty twenty six because you're gonna learn and hear from amy poe da ama modi of ant philanthropic dark patel sean evans from hot ones marquis brown league glen and doyle and world's best speakers and experts across marketing sales customer service ai they are all at about hundreds of amazing sessions and you know it's more than just the sessions it's about the networking it's about learning from your fellow attendees your peers understanding what people are doing really well where people are getting stuck that is how you break out that is how you are going to grow better and faster in twenty twenty six you're not gonna wanna miss it you can go to inbound dot com slash register to secure your ticket and your spot for inbound twenty twenty five okay the state of the state of ai video there's been a lot of buzz if you are on youtube or twitter instagram you're starting to see more and more ai videos as a marketer as somebody who runs a business is ai video ready for prime time is something we wanted to talk about today kieran part of the reason i wanted to talk about this today was just an excuse to show this video this is the latest ai video viral sensation i don't know if producer jar even seen it yet this person pablo made this video in a tool called hill ai and he got one and a half million views five hours across instagram and tiktok and he did a video on the cat olympics so this whole video is just cats doing different diving board jumps and i love it more than anything i've seen in a long time like the back flips yeah i think come on i like that there's all different kind of cats the physics of the diving boards and stuff are pretty good like there are a couple eras and stuff you can catch in there but it's pretty wild that we went from like terrible ai videos a year ago to where somebody who's just playing around could make a really good thirty five second video of cats as olympia you know like the world needs this yeah i think the quality of the video that i'm seeing have gone way up now what i'm trying to figure out is are they like one shot which means they were just created from prompt or is there a lot of editing in like i know you're trying to create a video with them as well from this tool but i think then v three per practically just released a new video tool yeah video heating up we thought this was gonna be the year of video and then chat gp image jen kinda came out and took the video thunder but now second half of the year videos picking up some steve's so here is like per complexity out of the gate here oh this guy i love this guy yeah the guy is a well known x influencer and they created a little video yeah again i have not tested the model we should get in there and test to see how good it is but looks pretty good quality i think the unlock for video as when you can do longer clips yeah kieran i think if you're watching this show one of the core takeaways i have the state of video is ai video used to not be good enough at all used to be terrible right and now you can get really good eight to fifteen second clips of either a person talking with a specific background or like a cool b roll type of scene or something and you just showed some great examples of both of those but you still need to know how to do some basic video editing to stitch them together to put in any kind of visual effects and everything that you want you can't get just say hey i want this video i want this scene to be this this other scene to be this and stitch it all together and make it good right like you still have to do a lot of manual video editing work yeah the v three stuff is like the most incredible stuff because it actually is longer clips the quality is incredible this blew up a network tv actually approved this so it's actually going to go live again probably a little bit of edit going on but this person made this video in like two days and they actually give you the prompt and everything they use to make it so this was like a huge hit that all might been luke paying attention to is it's like bringing a historical character's life yes alright guys we are headed to troy right now we've been trying for ten years and we still can't get in alright quick update the trojan seriously locked it down we're gonna regroup figure something out i've been thinking it through i was thinking if we hide in something and tell him it's a gift they'll let us in the only thing i have to figure out is what that's something is alright little sneak peek look at this beast the guys have been at all night putting in work he's gonna turn out real nice right boys yeah okay this might be the last update before we try it we go in tomorrow night what a great way to learn about history it's incredible right so someone obviously stitched together bunch of highlights they're using from v three but i think v three is just like pretty incredible from what i've seen so far so there are a couple of things here one of the big tent polls for ai video was this ai ad that was created and played during the nba finals somebody was able to make a very good very compelling ai ad that was good enough to put on a major video stream national broadcast in america right and it's like this crazy gta grand theft auto style ad it's wild vibe korean it's something that if you were to have actually shot this in real life for ka which is like a crypto bedding platform i think i mean dji on dj baby like this would have taken months to shoot in real life with all these actors in all these settings right would be very expensive and i think this was turned around in two days right so this whole video was made in two days which is wild and i would just like to hear from you like what do you think this means for the future of video ads are we just going to have like hyper precise personalized video ads everywhere is every major television show or sporting event gonna have super personalized ads of what just happened the day before like where this going well i think for the average business you can get much more personalized because you can actually do many many different types of ads for lower cost so what you can do is segment your audiences into smaller groups and create ads for a smaller niche set of your audience because and a world gone by you wouldn't have done that because it would be too expensive but if you're like creating videos via v three and it's a prompt a little bit of editing in two days you could actually look at your audience and say well i'm gonna create a whole variety of different ads segment my audience much smaller be way more precise in that target and create creative for them so i guess like one in of the spectrum in the other end of the spectrum there's probably this twelve month period where when you create these ads via these tools they're pretty off the wall yeah like you can just be like way more creative and it looks quite unique so the reason the cat one gets so many more views right now is because it's a novel idea it's a unique idea it's a pretty off the wall idea and they're gonna get a ton of traction so i just like advertising but just social content i think more and more and more your feed is gonna be filled with this incredible amount of video content created by ai personalized to you because what v three can do within the prompt is you can literally say like here are the characteristics of the person here's all of the things that they enjoy and create the video just for them now what happens when everyone is able to do this like i think again there's a arbitrage opportunity where you're too using these tools much faster and get them way more visibility because of that i think we are seeing the text to video really start to accelerate like it has never been as good as we thought it would be but deal three these other tools are starting to really get us to a pretty good spot although i will say you know a lot of the tools are still these eight second clips there's not much you can do with an eight second clip right you can stitch them together actually i think that's what me to do is story board them yeah that's what you can do need just stitch them together look if you're a really good director and you've got a really good script you can just do it all yourself now so instead of having to go do a big shoot right like you can choose your creative direction you can set all of that up the ad that we showed they did in two days that's why is because they got the clips fast and they could spend all their time and the editing and putting it together and getting the sale and audio right and do the things that make an ad spot really great right and i think the thing that is really transformative to me about all this is the accessibility of what video is going to bring you're going to see way more video advertisements in the world in general because a lot of people were priced out of that before karen it's like cool yeah it's not that expensive for me to advertise on youtube but it's pretty expensive for me to make some good videos to put on youtube and then spend more money to youtube to display them now the price of making a good video ad is coming way way down yeah we're working on some ai fifteen seconds spots that are generated by ai will cover that on a future show but i think the cost for each spot x the editor like director's time is gonna be like five hundred bucks yeah yeah before that would have been fifty thousand five hundred thousand depending on the fidelity of the shoot you were gonna do right right if you actually look at the data and most buyers if you were talking to marketers there are number one preference to consume short from video to learn about things but it's just been a hard thing to create short from video like it takes tools it takes money it takes skills and it still takes creative ideas and the ability to prompt and likely some editing but with these tools you can actually start to bring those concepts to life do short from video fulfill that need for your consumer much much better right look i think the beauty of ai tools right now i was that allows you use as a marketer to ship more create more and this is another good example of that yes i actually think the three is one of the most creative tools you can actually use right now i just really wish i could get freaking access to it i wasn't in ireland so here's one of my other favorites it's basically just people falling into sink calls oh yes i saw this somebody on twitter was like it's a toxic trait of mind that i'm just obsessed with sink videos i mean this is people are just making videos of v three that's it's just like a sink hole in the background and somebody falling to the over and over it i love it so much this guy hurts to repair crumbling infrastructure but as you can see some issues are more parent than others authorities are urging residents to avoid the area there's as you behind me what i haven't seen the truckload on elm street examining the city's ongoing efforts to address critical infrastructure issues like this rather large pothole hole behind me it's so i mean but isn't it scary that i actually could just scroll through a feed of v three videos oh yeah the fact that google hasn't made an easy way to do that to like market v three as well well i guess they are doing pretty good with marketing and v three a lot of people have it it's just i'm mostly obviously salty because i can't get it right now in ireland but when you see what people are doing with v three you really just see there's this huge amount of creativity in folks like in people and it all comes out when you get these tools you just see this whole explosion of like these incredibly creative ways of using these tools it could agree more that's why i love about them but they're some of my favorites you know there was a whole thing on the incident by one person versus a hundred grill yes and then someone did a view of three of actually how that would play out it's just like a ton of like cool things look it is a great time to be a creative person video when it comes to ai is getting much better you can now make very good videos if you have a good director editor and some of these tools but you cannot yet make a really good video if you're just like a non technical non video oriented person and that's kinda of where we're at in the middle of this year okay kieran is gonna go and watch tons of ai videos this has been fun to kinda do a little check on ai video with you all today we'll see you real soon a marketing to get great everyone if you're like me you love learning from the best and you just love learning period and a podcast that is all about learning is one that i love it's called billion dollar moves it's hosted by sarah chen spellings it's brought to you by hubspot media and sarah is awesome and she covers really what it takes to build a remarkable business she's a venture capitalist she's a strategist she has really hard questions and what's to find the highs and the lows from the most successful builders and entrepreneurs of our time so that we can learn from them and make our own billion dollar moves she's got a great episode around the big bet mindset and how you really build bold change for your company it's awesome you're gonna wanna check that out as well as all of her reps that's ross highly recommend you can listen to billion dollar moves wherever you get your podcast

everyone one of the biggest things happening in marketing right now is the evolution of search and people's traffic from old school google search is going down on down on down today i'm gonna walk you through how to get your ai search traffic your traffic from chat gp complexity and the all to go up up and up i'm gonna give you a free tool to help you make ai search friendly content i'm gonna show you how to do it all let's get into today's show we right back to today's show first i gotta tell you about a week that you're not gonna wanna miss it is a highlight of my year over year it is inbound which is hubspot annual event where we bring together the best attendees is the best speakers the best experts in sales in marketing customer success in ai and we all learn together and we all figure out how to grow our businesses better in the coming year and this year it's no exception it's a fire lineup it's gonna be at the moscow center in san francisco california september third through the fifth so it's a great way to kinda close out q three and kick off q four really strong and have your heads right for twenty twenty six because you're gonna learn and hear from amy poe da ama modi of ant philanthropic dark patel sean evans from hot ones marquis brown league glenn and doyle and the world's best speakers and experts across marketing sales customer service ai they are all at inbound hundreds of amazing sessions and you know it's more than just the sessions it's about the networking it's about learning from your fellow attendees your peers understanding what people are doing really well where people are getting stuck that is how you break out that is how you are going to grow better and faster in twenty twenty six you're not gonna wanna miss it you can go to inbound dot com slash register to secure your ticket and your spot for inbound twenty twenty five okay so the show is all about how do i get more visibility in ai search engines and the first thing you need to do is understand how to do that if you haven't already go back and watch our show with asia frost we do a massive deep dive at ai seo the trends the fundamentals that you need to understand to be successful in this new era of ai search okay i want to go through with you kind of the next natural iteration here and that is now you understand the principles we talked about that up so if you're gonna wanna go and create content for these ai search engines and to do that i thought i would help you today thought i would show you how to make a custom gp to do that and a custom gp second agent inside a chat gp i'll be honest with you i was kinda struggling at what to do for a show today and i was going back and forth and i got this idea from a conversation and chat gp says hey build a zero click content optimize and that's like kind of a do way of saying it and i was having a conversation with it around what is this new o three pro model which we have yet to talk a ton about on the show what's it really good at and what parts of marketing should it really be helping with so i was in o three just a regular o three and it gave me an idea to create this optimize or agent it gave me some code gave me instructions was great then i said to o three pro make this even better and o three pro thought for twenty four minutes and twenty one seconds and what it did is it made a full markdown prompt is a very technical way of saying a set of technical instructions for a custom gp to make the zero click content optimize agent it gives it all the rules it gives it the exact workflow it wants to do it is pretty awesome and so what i'm doing now is i'm gonna take all this entire prompt and i am going to just drop it here in my custom gp and again for those who aren't familiar you can go to chat gp on the left hand sidebar hit create a gp and this is the screen that comes up and this is configure and so i'm calling this an ai seo content builder and this gp creates ai friendly content to increase the likelihood of showing up in zero click search results and so i've added this prompt and this is basically a set of instructions it's telling your mission is to write one source article so thoroughly that leading ai assistance chat gp per complexity gemini and i claude quote and summarize it verbatim when answering the target query so it's really looking at these conversations the specific subset of them as search conversations here so this is really good it's got some very interesting rules in terms of oh start with a less than forty five word answer that directly answers the question around the topic right and so these are pretty cool the other thing i like about custom gp is that you can upload knowledge so one of the other things i did is i did a deep research project in chad gp on ai seo best practices and one of the things we also haven't talked about on the show yet but i love now when you have it do deep research it puts it in a canvas like this detailed kinda text box and in this canvas you can easily share a link just to the deep research or download a pdf of the deep research which i love so i had chat gp do it i'm giving this gp all of the knowledge that we have found about ai seo best practices so that when it's making decisions and following these instructions it has the context to do so recommended model we're gonna say o three pro this is really important work if this work is sloppy or low quality we're not gonna get ranking we're not going to be successful so you would rather aim for higher quality than speed in this type of work because you are trying to get better rankings on these really important search queries we don't need to create a new action so we're gonna go and now create this i will let anyone with the link use this gp maybe i will share it with all of you leave a comments if you want me to share this with you but i'm show you exactly how to build it yourself as well i'm gonna go i'm gonna view my gp now i have some topics to test this with here is an example of a topic that people would search in a search engine how is hubspot crm better than spreadsheets in twenty twenty five and i say hey highlight easy setup in our unified data so now putting this into our brand new gp look i'm gonna get real with you all i love o three pro o three pro has been great and i've been using it for a lot of tasks it's very very smart but that smart comes at a trade off it is not that vast relative to all the other ai models i think it's hilarious right i'm like oh this model's kinda slow and not that fast i'm like three years ago me would've have thought this was the most life changing output of all time and would have been fine if it took a week to have happened right and now i'm like oh it's like ten minutes i don't know like i just need to get a grip so what is this story just to make sure everybody understands i gave it a set of instructions and then i could take anything that i've either think or know my audience searches for in these ai search agents and i just put that topic right into my custom gp and it will write a custom page of information that is reverse engineered to give a remarkable answer on this topic so that those ai tools and the will find this information and use it and cite it and hopefully even say it verbatim because it's saying the stuff that i believe to be true in the world about in this case hubspot crm and that will be really really remarkable and that is a really powerful way to win the ai search game in a way that nobody's thinking about right now have you been thinking about building web pages for robots or have you been thinking about building those pages for traditional google search and for humans versus the ai search engines and that's what today's show is all about everyone if you like me you loved learning from the best and you just love learning period and a podcast that is all about learning is one that i love it's called billion dollar moves it's hosted by sarah and spellings it's brought to you by hubspot media and sarah is awesome and she covers really what it takes to build a remarkable business she's a venture capitalist she's a strategist she has really hard questions and wants to find the highs and the lows from the most successful builders and entrepreneurs of our time so that we can learn from them and make our own billion dollar moves she's got a great episode around the big bet mindset and how you really build bold change for your company it's awesome you you're gonna wanna check that out as well as all of reps that's awesome highly recommend you can listen to billion dollar moves wherever you get your podcast alright everyone we have our results we wanted it to create a page of web content that was ai search friendly for this specific question people would ask how i'll help hubspot here and beats spreadsheets in twenty twenty five o three pro took thirteen minutes that's what i'm saying it's not fast but the outputs is really high i call you don't have to use o three pro you can use any different model that you may have and what's interesting is remember i had it export everything in json so it could go into a web editor and have the right heading and formatting and everything necessary in order for it to be read well by the ai searching and so it says hubspot crm outperform spreadsheets by giving teams a plug and play workspace that's live in minutes and keeps every contact email deal and activity in one continuously synced record ending copy and paste errors in rogue versions for good so it gave you that tl right that's part of the instructions it followed it really well it talks about what problems duke spreadsheets create so what i've done is so i've taken this template that ai search engines like based on all these best practices and i have figured out a way for any topic to have this agent go research find that information and package it in a way that is really good for ai search engines fast start checklist one of my big things with ais seo that we're moving from just telling people what the answer is helping people move to action so it's got all of this and it's done a really really good job it also talks about unified data it talks about pricing how you can get started for free with hubspot crm it's got all of this marked up perfectly in json and it's awesome and it tells you what the word count is five hundred and sixty four words the reading level the keyword density around hubspot crm is little less than one percent of the density on the page versus spreadsheets that are point seven one percent it talks about what products and entities are covered in this this is awesome if you're hiring a consultant this is what they're gonna go and do manually and i have just made this for you and i'm giving it to you for free you could put any topic you want in there it's gonna give you an output like this you can go and put it in your website builder add a couple images and have a really good and compelling page that can start ranking in ai search engines all for free if you want we have the link to this custom gp it's down in the description i highly recommend checking it out would love to hear feedback as if it's working well for you but this is going to help you raise your game and win in the era of ai search i hope this is helpful let me know leave a comment we'll see you real soon on marking against the green

this is a canvas episode today we are breaking down the ai search engine optimization playbook everything you need to do to get visibility awareness and traffic from services like chat gp we've got an amazing seo expert asia joining us today and we're gonna break down the playbook we got some amazing data to share with you all and we're gonna give you the step by step approach at the very end so you wanna watch this whole show let's get to today's episode we right back to today's show first i gotta tell you about a week that you're not gonna wanna miss it is a highlight of my year every year it is inbound which is hubspot annual event what we bring together the best attendees is the best speakers the best experts in sales and marketing customer success in ai and we all learn together and we all figure out how to grow our businesses better in the coming year and this year it's no exception it's the fire lineup it's gonna be at the moscow center in san francisco california september third to the fifth so it's a great way to kinda close out q three and kick off q four really strong and have your heads right for twenty twenty six because you're gonna learn and hear from amy poe da ama modi of ant philanthropic dark patel sean evans from hot ones marquis brown league glenn and doyle and the world's best speakers and experts across marketing sales customer service ai they are all at about hundreds of amazing sessions and you know it's more than just the sessions it's about the networking it's about learning from your fellow attendees your peers understanding what people are doing really well where people are getting stuck that is how you break out that is how you are going to grow better and faster in twenty twenty six you're not gonna wanna miss it you can go to inbound dot com slash register to secure your ticket and your spot for inbound twenty twenty five okay so you are busy doing seo it's where i started my career it's where kip in asia has spent a lot of time we used to get a ton of traffic from google search the blue links and all of that traffic is disappearing into the ai ether and it's disappearing into ai search and what we are gonna go through today is how to do ai search optimization that really is the new thing you have to focus on if you want to get visibility for your brand but the thing is it's so new it's really hard to understand like what is the playbook what should i do how do i make sure that my brand my product appears in ai search we're here to give you the full playbook for ai search optimization we are lucky to be joined by asia frost works at house hubspot one of the best minds on this topic and so i wanted to kick off with this i was like looking at something this morning i was actually looking at the growth in ai companies in general just how quickly they are growing revenue and i thought this was a pretty amazing chart just to kind of help people understand what's happening because for the average business i hear like two types of stories i hear wow this is really starting to impact us we don't know what we should do we have decline in organic search traffic what do i do do i do seo do i optimize for google ai views do i optimize for and then you have other businesses who say no i don't believe this this is gonna take forever to actually impact us it's gonna happen over a very long period of time and what this chart shows here is the time to reach one billion users chat heat took two and a half years google took thirteen years so chat did it ten years earlier and so it feels like this is telling us that users are voting with their thumbs and fingers and actually going to type all of their deepest darkest thoughts into chat pd for google yeah i think that's right the more and more that i talk to our customers the more and more i'm just ea dropping in on people on the street i'm hearing them say i am going to chat jb and my next question is always and how much are you using google and they pause and i say you know i'm using it a lot less yeah everyone is using a lot less this is the other one with i really caught my attention which is what i'm showing here is it's a chart that shows the estimated l versus organic search value like if you had told people in twenty twenty five or not not even twenty twenty five i remember when we did the first show like i think of our this in twenty twenty three and when we were talking about the fact that this is gonna really disrupt google because it's a much better experience so even if you if you pulled this chart back to twenty twenty three how quickly traditional search has become un bundle into these ai chat l it's actually one of the wildest disruptions that i can ever remember yeah we're talking about this the other day it's happened incredibly quickly probably more quickly than we had anticipated the other really interesting thing about this chart that you're showing is the total ll value which we can see is more than just the traffic that's being attributed to l in in other words someone coming from an l is worth more to us than someone coming from traditional search and why do we think that is it's because someone is completing their entire buyer's journey in ai search they're going from i have a problem to this is the solution very quickly and because people feel like these l are giving them very objective unbiased results i think they're also trusting those answers a lot more than the answers than they would have found on say google asia i think that's right and i think if you're watching the show today you means you're pretty in the know and you kind of have a sense of what's going on but you're probably working with a lot of people who don't have this level of context and you're trying to get them board the most simple explanation is like google and those ten blue links that was an answer engine and if you were a company you could create some articles that provide some answers and get some traffic for it l and ai overview in all the ways ai is changing search that's an action engine people can go and take very specific action they can buy they can research they can take the next step of the problem they're trying to solve in a much more actionable way and that's one more valuable to be in business but also takes a very different approach which we're gonna talk about in this show of what you need to do differently but that's like the simplest heuristic that i can provide if you were just like talking to your a ceo to try to explain what is happening but i think what kieran is showing here is the thing we have to talk about is that the l visitor is worth way more than a traditional search visitor in asia you've really dug into this so i want you to kinda like break that down for us but like one of our early hypothesis is like hey we're gonna get less traffic from l but that traffic is gonna be worth more and sc sem i'm russia saying it's worth over four x more but like break that down for us help us understand what that actually means sure when you have traditionally captured someone from organic search you know you're capturing them in all different parts of the buyer's journey maybe they are to use a hubspot example just trying to learn where content marketing is so they go to our blog they read a content marketing guide one zero one maybe they download a kit to help them start implementing content marketing techniques and we hope that over you know two to three weeks maybe two to three months maybe two to three years as we continue to educate them about concepts related to our product they eventually decide to talk to our sales team or become a free customer so that entire journey takes a very long time and along the way we are giving them helpful resources to help them understand that hubspot is the answer to their content marketing need now someone is going to chat gb they're saying chat gb tell me everything i need to know about content marketing and chat gb is doing that in an incredibly personalized helpful way they are reaching the understanding that they need a content marketing solution a lot more quickly and they are also learning about all the potential options for content marketing solutions much more quickly by the time they decide that hub spot is the content marketing solution for them and go to our website all of that earlier nurturing has already happened and they wanna talk to sales really quickly and we see this actually in our gong calls i have a habit of looking at our sales called transcripts every week and i see over and over and over again yeah chad gb said you were the best so i came to you chad is my best friend they said hubspot is the crm i need to use and there was a pretty incredible stat because i think we know this has happened which is eighty percent of the b buyer journey has typically started with google and over time that's gonna become l m's they believe it's gonna reach around ninety five percent will start their journey with an l i think what you're talking to is it's not just a start third journey within an l it's like they don't really end it like it it's all self contained within the l and so it gets much harder to actually reach that consumer because they can do so much more in the ll and they trust l they believe it can give them the right answers it's on unbiased the other you know i think part of that is and i know we're we're gonna get into giving you some actual actionable things you can do but i think this was the other one i think is related to that which is like a challenge for brands which is they're in the l they're doing a bunch of that research and what this is showing us is what the l m's reference are not really vendor websites they're all of these kind of third party websites that aggregate together different vendors and so like when they did this study jason tu he looked at a bunch of data and he said that the brand's actual website was only mentioned nine percent of the time so only nine percent of the times for these queries was a brand website mentioned and the links that's pretty incredible like when you look at what they're citing in and the sources they're side in it's not really like vendor websites i'm not sure have you seen that asia in your analysis or has that kind of be one thing that has stood at yeah i think that this is really interesting data because i think what we don't know yet is whether l m's prefer third party websites because they consider them less bias right than vendor websites or if they prefer that content because that content is inherently more ingest for an l so when we transition to how do you optimize for ai search a lot of the ai search emerging best practices are things that these third party websites have already been doing it's just how their content is set up and displayed so i think that there's a real advantage if you're are a vendor to start applying these ai search best practices and become a much more cited domain in your space okay before we get into the house there's a couple things i wanna talk about part of the topic that you're talking about which is like who is showing up an i think it's important for us to give everybody the context is that google has been on a decade plus long journey in fight to do two things one deliver personalized search experience and things like chat gp with memory have kinda trump that experience and i think have been able to deliver a personalized search experience in the way that google always wanted to the second thing is that google laid this road roadmap where it was totally embroiled in all these lawsuits with publishers like google stealing our traffic google stealing our revenue and i think it's safe to say that opening i has seen that and wants to avoid those problems right and they're going to likely make decisions and i think are making decisions in terms of content partnerships and things to avoid those problems and so as you're thinking about your strategy i'd encourage all to have those two factors involved which is one search has gotten way more personal and two if open has a partnership or has lower risk with a site or a service that that is probably gonna have some likelihood it's gonna be included in results versus something that they'd have a higher risk for is that right yeah i think we've seen that in the data about which l m's prefer which sources if you map those preferences by the media and content sites that each l has partnered with you can see clear relationships like for example both google and open ai have partnerships with reddit and reddit shows up very frequently for both reddit and quo are the two biggest sites like you would've have thought quo would be such a pinch pin of well i guess it is because if you look at the data what they're really relying on them is use generated content quo was never able to make a real business out of its actual business they probably are making a pretty good business out of someone training data but they're are the two biggest sites that appear in these l and then as you're saying so like the example there would be if you go to chat you're likely not gonna find anything from the new york times because they have an upcoming in court case and i do agree you kept i'm not sure of open ai are doing that good of a job of at avoid and copyright lawsuits seats and available i'm saying that they're kind of your incentivized to do that is what i'm saying brand more often or not are probably gonna at try to do that is what i'm saying yeah the the follow up question i have to both of you is can you have an effective ai search optimization strategy without engaging on communities like reddit and having a strategy on communities like reddit i think it's a good question but i think the setup up here for asia is okay i'm a business i can spend my time on the blue lengths which i just wanna say even though i said from the outset the blue links are gonna die the best times in my marketing career we're messing around with the blue links that was like a good time blue link nostalgic i'm i'm gonna the the nostalgia part of blue links i i i think if we're gonna miss the times where you could really scale an engine that was predictable you could generate a ton of revenue and you could do it in a way that actually you could have like limited matter of resources but pretty good knowledge and actually make some real impact and i think that's gonna be a tough a tough thing to i think you're being a little pure and negative on this go ahead issue not being i don't be negative let me finish the setup right so like i think that the blue links go away for informational content we can talk about that but like you can spend your time optimizing for blue links and we should talk about what if anything the person should do there then they can optimize for google ai reviews so we're gonna talk about this ai reviews are becoming the prevalent way for google to start to surface up search they said that ai mode is gonna be the default mode and lots of seo people went on x and linkedin and quite a lot because that is a a tough thing to navigate as well when an ai overview apparently appears for a search result the number one blue link gets around thirty three percent less traffic so like there's some real lowering of the traffic and then you could optimize for l m's right so you have your search traditional blue links you have your ai o overview which google and you have your l and so what are you telling people why do you think i'm overly negative random blue links and what do you tell people to do asia i understand the nostalgia for the blue links i spend some time in the grief period as well here's what i'll say this is hilarious i used to day dream and this probably gives you a peek into my psyche about what it would be like to go back to the early days of seo and just have an open field of experimentation i will be totally honest in the past couple years seo had gotten pretty stale yeah we knew what worked and we just did what worked and it was really predictable and was really boring and now we had brand new open field again and as everyone is starting to figure things out that means that no matter where you're starting from you can be a start you can be a big company like hubspot no one has a big edge right now the edge goes to the people who figure out the new tactics the most quickly and i think a lot of it is going to rely on ai powered content systems which as y'all have talked about on this podcast pretty much every time you talk means you don't need a ton of people you don't need a huge team or a lot of money to get these systems going and so i think that people in twenty years are gonna be nostalgic for this period yeah so i think kip and i agree with this i i i would swapped out seo would marketing in i thought marketing was really full was so bored i got it was pretty call me crazy i was gonna go and open a coffee shop i used to tell kip about that i was like this is boring i mean i didn't have a lot of conversations it's about like out maybe we should just like do something different it's so boring i agree i'm all back in because it's all being rebuilt yeah so back to the core question of alright well i have a bunch of different audiences or platforms what do i optimize for if i was a business starting with very little organic traffic i would be all in on l because i think the amount of time that it would take you to establish an seo strategy that works by that time all your personas are using chat gb or google's mode as their core way of getting information if you have an existing seo infrastructure and you have a lot of traffic to protect then this is not a flip switch scenario i think you need to protect what you've got while investing and scaling your ai search optimization tactics over time and the best ai search tactics will not be bad for google and i think that that's a little counter but if you are doing ai search well it will not hurt your google rankings and hopefully it will even help everyone if you're like me you love learning from the best and you just love learning period and a podcast that is all about learning is one that i love it's called billion dollar moves it's hosted by sarah chen spellings it's brought to you by hubspot media and sarah is awesome and she covers really what it takes to build a remarkable business she's a venture capitalist she's a strategist she has really hard questions and what's to find the highs and the lows from the most successful builders and entrepreneurs of our time so that we cannot all learn from them and make our own billion dollar moves she's got a great episode around the big bet mindset and how you really build bold change for your company it's awesome you're gonna wanna check that out as well as all of her reps that's awesome highly recommend you can listen to billion dollar moves wherever you get your podcast i think that is one of the most important points of the entire show is that these are not mutually exclusive things is what you're telling everybody right like exactly you're really focused on ai seo you are going to get l and ai overview traffic but you're also gonna get some traditional blue link traffic from those efforts exactly the one thing i wanna tee up before we get into the deep to on everything because i wanna hear from both of you because i have a controversial take because we're talking about how how this is a new era and there's a bunch of new opportunities and i think what stops people from taking advantage of new marketing eras opportunities arbitrage is because they look at the world in the old way versus the new way and one of the things about the old way is that visits were highly correlated to customers and revenue because what would happen is you had much more control of your visits through advertising through traditional google search and your conversion of those visits to customers would stay pretty flat pretty consistent right you didn't have as much control of the conversion rate and so it's like oh i know that one percent of my visits are gonna convert into customers i just gotta go get some more visits was kinda of the old way of thinking it and i think everybody watching the show and i get emails from founders financial analysts all these people like oh what are the visits doing here and i'm i wanna come out and be like i think visits are fundamentally less important and in some ways unimportant and that's like the hottest take i've had in a while because of the new ways people are discovering sites and brands and i wanna see if you all agree or disagree with me there wanna hear from asia given that she has spent a lot of her queer ten x and visits to websites talk wasn't something like i'm nostalgic for no i completely agree and not just because you know that would be easier for me if we all felt that way over the next few years here's the thing if we go back to what we were talking about earlier how someone was gonna visit hubspot many times over over the course of a few weeks to a few years before they eventually convert if we say all of those interactions are now happening in l but they're still eventually coming to hubspot and buying then yeah the value of an individual visit matters a lot less what we care about is that ultimate visit that visit where they decide to become a user or a customer and what we what hubspot growth team is increasingly shifting to is visibility in l how often are we showing up as the recommended solution for the questions for the challenges that our personas have i think this is a great segue into a couple of things why you should listen to the next segment of the show because asia and her team have done a pretty great job of making sure okay can everybody's ass let's be real i'll start really visible so what are we looking at here we're looking at one of the metrics from the tool we use to measure our awareness in these l and i think one of the things that will jump out you straight away is share a voice this is in quote unquote ai search optimization tool and that is a brand metric and i think that's one of the things to wrap your head of brands is that you have to kinda think much more like a traditional brand market here you're looking for impressions you're looking for visibility you're looking to make sure that your brand is more visible than other brands in these l and then me just walk us through this chart asia just i'm representing the comment guys and gals so you'd be like what tool is this what tool is this what what are you showing yeah we just need to give people a little information because there's gonna be questions i pass it back to asia you can kinda jump into the tool and maybe talk a little bit about how we use it so this is zach funnel there are a bunch of tools out there that will show you l visibility and which websites are being cited in l we chose funnel because the founder and his team they're really experimentation centric and i think that this era is all about experimenting as quickly as possible learning as quickly as possible and then feeding those learnings back into your playbook hey asia on the tool selection yeah because you and have had a little bit of conversation on this because we're gonna get questions about it there's a bunch of people doing it ex funnel haul like there's literally like ten companies doing this yeah if not more the differentiation i have been told from you is that it's pretty low and like you should pick the one that you kinda like the best and you think is going to evolve at a fast rate which is one of the reasons you picked x funnel but like they're all using kind of the same approach and kind of the same data so it's not like that there's one that is far and way better than everything else at this moment yeah is that right there's no moat in this space at this moment i think if someone can figure out how to really simulate all the context that an ll has about a person or a user when they're talking that would be a real competitive advantage if someone can nail the volume piece thinking about you know what we're saying around it's getting a lot harder to measure we have a lot less direct visibility between what made someone convert if someone can figure out okay the number of times that a question is being asked in l that would be a huge competitive advantage yeah but yeah i think the tool that will win here and i think it's only doable if open ai or these kind of models decide to have a partnership is the tool that can actually log in with your chat and integrate your memory mh because then they can mimic the memory in the tool and i think that's the big thing is like because memory is just drastically changes what our results are going to be i don't think it's a business model that they're gonna particularly want to get into unless the only kind of wrinkle here is if they do a freemium tier and they have a paid platform then they will give optimization tools and i don't know if they get when give those optimization tools to businesses will there be something there that would help you better track visibility across that freemium tier look i would bet my house that they're gonna do ads and there's gonna be some analytics around ads is what i think you're saying kieran yeah right yeah and that that will probably be a next important step of the journey of understanding of what needs to happen yep i am very much looking forward to getting some data google has started introducing ads into ai mode and we are a google advertiser and so we should start getting some data from from ai mode which i'm i'm excited to dive into yeah i think the memory piece is really hard and what beer and the team at ex funnel have done to try to simulate that as much as possible is forcing the l to think as a persona so as a vp of sales as an enterprise a we have about ten personas that we've loaded into here across our core products it's a very crude solution but karen i think it it gets to what you're talking about yep so yeah so over here you can see our visibility across all the l that x funnel tracks i would say we're really focusing on search gb chat gb and gemini right now because that's where we see the majority of usage happening tell people what search gp just so that people because i i think that's not a common mon and so i'm just yeah trying to represent viewers here sure search gb is the searching system that chad gb uses so you can have regular chat gb responses where the web is not actively being searched and then you can layer in search now i think as the l m's get more and more sophisticated you probably won't have a choice about search with exactly so this we will probably at some point just see us chat e this will probably just be google and then what we were looking at a little earlier is hubspot share of voice yes kit after like come in school sorry i'm just trying to ask all questions does jim and i include ai overview in google or is that act actually just like i need to be in the gemini experience fantastic question just in the gemini experience so we actually used a completely separate tool this is what i'm driving yeah we use a separate tool to track ai overview which are those ai generated summaries at the top of a ser you don't have to be logged into any special experience or really do anything to opt into that you're getting it by default and the third google experience is ai mode which users in the us are now seeing as a tab on their google experience at some point ai mode will become the primary google experience that's gonna be like a seven point seven earthquake on the marketing richter scale yeah yeah you're probably under selling it in actuality how far up does it go like while we're talking goes to ten it goes to ten yeah alright well we'll say it's a ten earth earthquake gonna be real it's gonna be real yeah so but i think the question under the question is how much can we learn just from looking at gemini and gemini is the system that powers ai mode is powers ai overview and it obviously powers the gemini specific experience but it is only a a piece of the puzzle right now i can think we should just you know blow this up print this out hanging on our walls right now hubspot has the most share voice for the queries and the personas that we are tracking now if i was gonna be skeptical about this chart if i was kieran i would say well how are those queries chosen nick is that for every conversation that hubspot could ever show up in and we hand selected these queries we said okay these are all the queries that we think our personas are asking which is obviously pretty different from how seo works where you can literally go into aa ahrefs or search console and see the actual queries the people have asked and and how much volume is behind them so super imperfect but i think that this tells us that we are definitely on the right track for the topics that we care about i know you have a point here as well we should just quickly touch on this because this is like a version of a aided slash una awareness study where you have to kinda guess the survey questions like it's just so much different from what we were able to do in search where you could see the keywords and just figure out what are the ones you should actually go and look at to see if you appear and the other thing is and we're gonna i think you're gonna give some guidance in this into ai when you get into like how you actually manage to do this did you manage get how should be so visible the actionable will takeaways is people how they ask questions in ai is gonna be so much different than search like search taught us to ask in key phrases now ai is just how you con and is hugely different in trying to like predict how people talk to another person that's how they treat ai i think it's different not only in how they talk to the l but in terms of the type of content that we need to create maybe this is a good segue into those tactics yeah i would just say as we transition before traditional google you would search something wouldn't be quite right and you would keep her finding your search right and so one search would end up becoming twenty searches right right we're now like you have one search in chat g it asks you some clarifying questions and it gives you like a curated actionable response and that's a state holistically different experience and i think what we're trying to tell people is that experience is different how you measure that experience is insanely different and you need to start aligning your company to look thing about measuring this differently and i like what you were just showing there with like the share of voice of asia is it perfect no but i look at it as like it's you're defining where we're playing here are like the types of conversations we wanna play and are we winning where we're playing or not like it used to be an seo it's like oh we're gonna play everywhere and we're gonna win it's like no we have to really focus a little bit more and are we winning where we're focusing and i think that's a big evolution in the how this work is happening yeah absolutely alright let's tell people what they should do okay so i think the first big thing used to be that the quality of your content was why you won now i think it's about the specificity of your content and that doesn't mean that quality doesn't matter but if you think about how much more context someone is able to give in ad search they're able to tell chad lgbt all these things about them their business their needs now you don't just need an answer for what is the best x you need an answer for what is the best x considering that i am a manufacturing company in new jersey we've been around for ten years our growth is recently plateau we're spending a lot of money on paid ads and so that is an explosion of content for every persona and every problem that you have and it means then rather than thinking about okay how do i create these one to three really good pages on these head terms you need to think about how do i create these one hundred to three hundred great pages on all of these super long tail terms mh and no one including hubspot has the research is to do that if you have a blogger sitting at their keyboard typing out every word which means your job is a growth marketer as an seo as an ae whatever you wanna call yourself is okay how do i build systems for great content how do i build ai powered systems that will produce really great content at scale that is highly specific i think that last minute was probably the simplest articulation anybody can get around what is changing and what you need to do differently and what you're really also telling people is like you're gonna need ai to solve the ai search problem you cannot solve the ai search problem with manual old school work yes exactly so i'm a traditional search person i hear you say that and i think two things how do you make sure that content is unique and doesn't matter right like does matter like if you just change one data point for each industry and then have thousands of pages wherever you page had like a singular data points so how different do the pages have to be and one of the things you said i think was really good for folks earlier on the things you have to do for ai search will not be a drag on your traditional search mh no i could say that is going to be a drag because we always hear that google doesn't like you know paper thin content or lots of duplication of the pages so maybe talk through how you think about that i think if we were in a world where we didn't have to care about google at all then you could experiment with changing one data point on thousands of pages and see what happens there are a lot of indications that l m's care way less about what we've historically thought of as thin content or doorway pages basically the scaled content idea we know google cares about it and we know that google still matters so i would not just publish a bunch of pages with one thing different what we are doing we are publishing very unique pages with a lot of original data and i think that original data is the key to making this work yes now that original data doesn't need to be this huge study of you know something relevant to your persona across united states doesn't need to be big or expensive you can use the data that you have on your own customers which is probably where you should be grounding all these content efforts to start so if you know that using your product or service that manufacturing company in new jersey is likely to have three x higher close rates because you have seen manufacturing companies get that type of return that's exactly the type of data point you want to bring into this content and so start with your original data on your customers and use that to populate these pages another important point i think one of the important things for people to take away here is you're also talking about content that is really map to you're in buy in mode mh this is not informational content this is not like how do i teach you something and do thousands of pages you're specifically talking about hey you're already in that buy process and we're gonna create lots of different variations of our pages that would help you understand of where the right solution for you maybe talk a little bit about that like do you buy that fact there's little to no point any more invest in the informational educational content and instead you would spend all your time on content that is much more map to someone who's in buy mode i think there's a way to do the informational content but i think everyone including hubspot should start with the bottom of the funnel content i'm work well which is the opposite of a ten years ago exactly you've always had the most top of funnel content because that answers the broadest number of questions and that's again where everyone has been starting their journey and then you would have the least bottom of funnel content and now i think it's flipped i think you want the most bottom of funnel content and yeah karen i think it's a great call out because we went to data and it's probably hard to conceptualize where that data would even come in before you understand the type of content that we are talking about we are talking about content that says here is why this product or service is the best solution for this persona with this context and the idea is that when an ll is formulating an answer for a user they are pulling on that content that so they can say here is why this product or service is the best for your problem yeah and that's when you get that visibility into the l four the queries you really care about the way i think about this is you whip from starting at the top to starting at the bottom the leverage in ai search around the breadth and ultra long tail of product related information and queries and if you don't have a lot of public product information pricing information buying action data and information you're not gonna be successful and so you're gonna need to change your business there at the top of the funnel we've gone from teaching people how to do things to needing to give them tools to do the things themselves and kieran and you and i talked about we're gonna do a whole tools episode we're gonna build a couple mocks of if you were like the average b business what are some tools that you would try to build and use to capture people maybe a little further up the buyer's journey i do wanna talk a little bit about this as a segue into we should talk about citations because that really is your on page yeah strategy one quick clarifying question we should get into there is like any optimization in the structure of those pages we should quickly talk about yeah but the thing i wanted to quickly reference on the citations was because we're talking about it here is i was doing a ton of research on putting together this whole like what we know about everything you could want to know but how you can appear in and so by one of the questions i've always asked i go back and keep asking is like what are all of the signals that have been by that would actually tell us how l m's recommend products like is there anything be released i'm like why an l recommends a certain product and give me back this and i do think chat is starting to reference websites much much more and so in every answer give me it had these websites referenced there was one website it referenced several times kinda of released stood out to me it's like wow this website has got itself in the answer is a lot for this informational query and i went to it and it was like a pretty new website it's a actually an agency who does ai search optimization so kudos to them it's called growth marshall i don't know anything about them but the reason i it really stood it to me is like because of this chart it is a brand new site and it didn't appear in google searches for those queries and what this is telling us here that chart we're looking at is the rank in positions of l m site search results i think this is pretty interested in that these ai search assistants are referenced in sites that are not in google's top twenty results can you explain this chart i don't think this chart is obvious to everybody explain this means because this is a really interesting chart yeah it's basically saying chat t search primarily sites lower rank in search results and then what that's show google search right yeah the rank position in google of the sites that it's pulling into its resources and you can see here the majority are outside of the top twenty and i think that's fascinating so fascinating because we have been taught google works on page rank trusted sites so what is chat with he doing differently where it is reference in sites that are completely different than how google think about trust like obviously chat me you think about trust in a very different way i don't know if you have insights on that asia i think it's all about specificity mh i think that these websites that are being cited are targeting much more specific queries that have historically made no sense to target interesting and that's why they're getting pulled in chad does not care about site authority i think what's interesting is this minute towards into the show is the glimmer of sunshine the glimmer of hope in this whole episode it used to be if you were starting a business or you wanted to really change the trajectory of your business somebody would come to asia and you'd be like okay well alright you gotta set up a website you gotta create all this content you gotta hire these people to create content it's gonna take you six to eight months to build your authority and i think in a year we can get you to this level of traffic is that roughly right and now i think we're saying hey you can start a new site have a very focused strategy for l and you start getting traffic from l in days yep which is wild like completely different than like we've been used to thinking about this problem yeah are you still pessimistic kieran or has this raise just spirit no i like i wanna be really honest i would not be doing this role if ai i hadn't happened i was going to do something differently i just had got yeah pretty tired with the same old thing and so i'm a person i think if you're very similar i need new stuff to go after and figure right or there's no point me doing it right correct and so i couldn't be happier with what's happening but like my nostalgia for search was more i was doing search when it was being figured out and i just like the fact that i could exactly see the effort go in and then the money come out right and i i think that's just that they only nostalgia i have is like oh i do this thing and i get money coming out of here i just wanna make sure we end on one thing because i know we're gonna get screened that if we don't i do want you to tell people how they should think about citations because you've told them i think a really great takeaway on on page but what is your off page strategy how do you think about what brand should do to actually you know if we believe it's not all in your website what are the things you should do to get mentioned off upside and how should they do that yeah i think you wanna be repeated as often as possible in your core brand terms so we have several at hubspot but let's take crm as an example because that's always been a really important association for us we wanna get as many mentions as many positive mentions as possible across the websites that our l are pulling in as hubspot as a crm and in the old world for that to be valuable it needed to be a backlink it needed to be sending people directly to our website but we're just trying to train the model that hubspot is a crm and ideally that hubspot is a great crm so we don't really care about the backlink we just care about the mention and if i were starting from scratch i would use a tool like x funnel i would figure out the websites that are being cited in l responses and i would reach out to those websites and see if i could improve the number of mentions i had for my product for my key terms and we'll end on this mentions doesn't matter if it links right it's just like c citations words and you wanna make sure those c citations include the thing you want to be ranked for and so one last question you mentioned lots more pages in google's index for very specific queries mh do you have to have that level of specificity in the c citations like do i have to have hubspot crm from manufacturing company in ohio in an ideal world you would but i don't think that that possible for no anyone to do so i think you stick with the head terms you stick with the big ones like i'll give you a kirin in dark days of seo used to be in black hat forms i still think that one of the takeaways for someone like me in the chat media thing is chat media doesn't care at trust so what i could do in the interim where it doesn't really care about trust because it hasn't figured that out or doesn't care about that right now is i could like buyout websites i could create websites and i could just inject a huge amount of specificity into its index and c site a product or a brand and i do wonder how it would figure out not to like include those things in its trained model yeah i think it remains to be seen whether third party versus owned makes the difference yeah because if it doesn't then you might as well just do it all on your own site and that's actually a lot easier you would buy a bunch of third party sites and then just inject all of your c citations into them my sense is it would probably work for a little bit and then it would yeah i think we work for little of that bible prediction is that most companies will have account specific pages on their site meaning like hey i'm trying to market or sell to this account this company and i'm going to have a lot of content yeah specific to that company i think there's a test asia that we're gonna run around this and so we can come back with that the last last last question give everybody the recap that if they're like hey i'm bought in i want to win this new ai search game what are the couple of things they should go start doing now to be successful okay if you don't already know your personas you need to figure that out immediately then you need to set up ai powered systems to create highly specific content for those personas at scale you need to populate that content with as much unique firsthand data as you have i'm realizing we didn't even get into the structure of a page that's optimized we gotta do a follow yeah we need to do a part two yeah yeah well pay attention to all the stuff we're gonna talk about next and let your cmo know that visits don't matter how they used to and that we need to buckle up for a brave new world yeah you have to change how you're measuring the performance right and get a team and company aligned on that and that's a big thing yeah alright kieran in any words of optimism or pessimism before we rock out yeah i'm incredibly optimistic for the people who are deeply curious there's like a ton of opportunity here i think the thing is gonna be a struggle and interim as the attribution measurement i think that is a hard thing for the average company to overcome when they're trying to figure out how do i forecast what i'm gonna get back from all of this and that's just not possible i completely agree there's gonna be lots of things we could cover on this topic we're gonna do a follow ups shows leave comments below on certain topics that you want us to go deeper on or do follow ups shows asia we're gonna have you back on the show we're gonna cover a bunch more of this stuff thank you for taking some time to be on with us today and good luck to everybody out there in the ai search game we'll see you real soon on the next episode of marketing green alert alert we have a major announcement that you need to know we've got some big news hubspot crm and chat gp from open have come together for an amazing integration hubspot crm is now the first crm to integrate with chat gp deep research bring all of your customer contacts and data from hubspot into chat gp now you can do truly remarkable things to better grow your business marketing teams can find the highest converting cohorts and create tailored nurture sequences and then use those insights to launch automated workflows right inside a hubspot sales teams can effortlessly analyze deal pipelines identify at risk opportunities and receive ai guided suggestions for next steps to close deals fast faster this is a game changer i think this is one of the most important things that has happened to marketing and sales and customer service in years the hubspot deep research connector will automatically be available to all hubspot accounts free paid of them if you use hubspot you have access to this and it's available to chat gp team enterprise and ed subscriptions turn on the hubspot deep research connector in chat gp to get powerful phd level insights from your customer data

everyone if you like me you might get stuck sometimes and today shows about getting completely un stock we're joined by jason p who's got a great new book out called the case for more bad ideas and give you five free and amazing prompts that are gonna transform your creativity with whatever ai tool you use it can help you write better ads they're gonna help you get better feedback it can help you come up with amazing and out of the box content ideas if you're stuck trying to figure out the right name for something we got a prompt for you they're gonna change how you do any type of creative work this is a bang of a show let's get to today's show hey everyone on today's show we have an incredibly important topic that nobody talks about when it comes to marketing ai nearly enough and that is creativity and what's interesting is that most people don't think of themselves as creative people most people don't have creative process and both of those things are really fundamentally untrue and i get the pleasure today to be joined by my good friend jason keith who just wrote a book and that book is the case for more bad ideas and it's a book all about creativity and the creative process and one of the things that jason and i did for the day show is we took a lot of the fundamental concepts and process from the book and created prompts so that even if you are a solo or you're a team of one you can take these ideas and have chat g have claude have jim nine have whomever be your creative a partner and help you iterate and build a create a process for any of the business or marketing problems that you might have jason welcome to the show thanks for being here man thank you so much kip excited about today's is show and talking creativity with all these great people so one of the things you and i talked about before we started recording is you're like i've spent a lot of time on this topic and most people actually like just don't have a creative process and that sounds true to me but like what have you found like why do people actually need a process to be creativity i think we were taught growing up that's just like creative ideas come to us yeah i mean and that's true to an extent but to get better at something you really have to define a process for it and that could be a personal process there's lots of ways to be creative it's not like a plus b equals c but we just don't teach creativity you go to art school you go to ad agencies people have like the same brainstorming process that was taught you know in the thirties but there's nothing past that so i really wanted to take all these things that really created people do naturally and reverse engineer them and really dialed them back to core concepts so people can test and repeat and kinda grow around personal way to be more creative i think what's interesting is that the show we talk about ai a ton most of what we talk about and when people talk about it they talk about it in terms of like oh i'm more productive or i can automate this thing that used to take me a bunch of time what they don't actually talk about is that ai can be in a really amazing creative partner to help me just get a better quality of output work product idea out in the world and that's what the show today is all about and so before we kinda get into the prompting we're gonna give you all some amazing prompts they'll be down in the description below talk to me about like the big concepts from the book that kind of were the impetus for these prompts right like these prompts were kinda structured off of a lot of work you did reverse engineering what makes great creative actually great creativity yeah i mean i think the core concept up the book is bad ideas it's like the name of the book it's one of the first key chapters but it's just a small piece and that counterintuitive i mean bad ideas i say are the shortcut creativity they're one of those true things that are a shortcut that actually works and saves your time because it broaden the way hey you're thinking about a problem when you start with creative thinking you typically start in a small box mh and bad ideas and a lot of other things in this book will break you out that so using things like constraints assumptions collisions collisions are you know just doing more interesting things in your life so you're brushing up against life a little more you're getting more inputs and i think understanding that like the solo creator concept is a myth like collaboration on some point is required whether that's what they ai whether that's with you know if you're writing to book with your readers and your publisher if you're selling a product your your customer is kind of a collaborator right so it's always a collaboration point in front or behind you and just realizing when you need to break out of solo work and when solo work is really helpful yeah and i think what's interesting about what you just said is like i found the collision part of what you just said to be very true in my life that like it's human nature to be like oh i'm stuck i'm just gonna keep my head down and i'm gonna like just keep crying through this words it's like i've always gotten un stuck when i'm like on a walk or like doing an activity with friends or what happy where it's like oh this life experience a different way of seeing the situation has now taught me what i need to know to like actually break through and solve that hard problem that i was trying to solve right yeah i mean you've got incubation happening there too medi task i find that like taking a walk taking a shower doing the dishes there's also just like finding richer media and sources of information whether that's you know certain people or traveling like the guy who invented the first rolling suitcase it happened to him when he was on vacation and carrying heavy suitcases right it it's him out in the world experiencing pain and he was also he worked at a luggage company so he had his expertise that matches up against the life experience and that's where we make those collisions or connections yeah it's having that right like overlap and vin diagram of like life and knowledge which is super interesting okay so obviously we talk a ton about ai on the show this is our first show on ai dedicated for creativity which i'm super pumped about and we're gonna go through five amazing prompts for creativity today and maybe you could pull up just the prompts and just talk at a high level kind of the five things we're gonna be kinda talking about and working on i've done some of them for the first time and so i'll give everybody watching someone kinda of my feedback of what i thought and how they've worked and how i used them but i'd love to kinda hear your take of like hey this is why you made these prompts yeah i mean i think not everything in the book can be turned into an ai prop but i wanted to take the things that could be turned into a process and really put them to marketing use cases so the first one that we have is collaboration council so this you were speaking already to the fact of sometimes you don't have a team that can work with you sometimes you're working solo but you really would like some feedback so the point of this collaboration council prompt is to give you multiple personas to give you feedback i designed it kind of for website feedback mh which it works really well for like when i first used it i was shocked at how how well the feedback matched kind of what i knew needed to be fixed on my agency website but also things that i had not thought of but it also just gives in this case three specific personas a really strong p like they're not gonna e and be nice like a normal ai prompt wood so we have a a taste maker inspired by steve jones but we have the artist persona inspired by maya angelo and we have the skeptic inspired by anthony bo and really defined a little bit about they feel deeply and and what they react to and there's a very wildly different perspectives that i and i think getting that broader set of perspectives is always really helpful i think what's interesting for people is like even when you as a human are like i think this is a great for like but landing page website kind of feedback use case and a lot of user experience folks design folks you went to design with jason's like they'll go do user interviews but it's actually very hard to find really different sets of humans to talk to right like what you've done here is usually like i three vastly different perspectives it's like i might go talk to ten people but the variance between those ten people can often be very very small and it's nice to have a breadth of perspective and that's one of the things that i'm hearing so far from you is that like you have to change the aperture of both how you look at a problem how you get feedback on a problem to actually kinda break through and have enough change to be successful yeah i'm gonna steal that i haven't thought of aperture but that's a perfect word for it and you know a lot of marketers have kind of the customer personas saved does maybe a knowledge block that they use with chassis or other ai these are other personas that you can bring in these are you know experts or mentors or creative feedback sources that it can be important for i mean i've used it for ad creative i used it for several use cases it's a great when you need that initial feedback from a broad audience i've done something similar as like a personal board of directors like if i'm looking for advice or whatever like where you pick a set of people to do it that way but i haven't done it for like real creative feedback and i'm totally gonna steal this and we're gonna show everybody how to do all of these so we're talking about this first one which i really love let me show the second one real quick because i've been iterating on prompt number two and i'll show you where i'm at and you can tell me if i'm doing a good job in terms of how you thought it should work versus how i'm actually doing the second prompt you have is all around brainstorming like how do you get a lot of ideas and what's interesting jason is i've been thinking a lot recently about this like next era of marketing that we're in you know it's a marketing podcast i do marketing to marketers so it's like it's post ai world would we get a call marketing you know in the last twenty years inbound marketing content marketing we had a few big trends in marketing like what's the new trend in marketing actually gonna be called and so i wrote like a big memo on this topic with all my ideas with what's happening in the market all those things but like i couldn't come up with like a decent name at all and you'd wrote this prompt one of my favorite prompts i think i've ever seen which is a very detailed prompt to get naming ideas and get naming ideas in listen rounds you know so you're not just like getting a few ideas it's like you're getting twenty ideas and you're picking a few winners for me trained and you're kinda continuing to try to train and get closer to an example right yeah and you gave like kinda clear naming methods which i thought were really good this is like one of the best creativity prompts i've seen just because of how it's both trying to get to a creative output but it's doing it in a very like regiment way you know what i mean and most people wouldn't have put this much rigor into a prompt about naming which is why we'll share it with you all so i ran the prompt and i it came up with a bunch of kind of like portman man two words or like sm together words and i was like nope i don't want any any made up or combined words you know and so yeah i was like i see what's happening now and i was like i don't like any of these and i'm like this is exactly how it should be working yeah i should just be like very harsh with it and then it's like cool i need a checkpoint that's like very nice ai i speak for like you're not giving me enough information and feedback to like actually change my output and like the feedback i gave it is like none of these words connect enough with what's happening in the market and it's like if these were on a book cover or if somebody saw one of these in a vacuum how would they know this was about like marketing versus like some other like obscure business concept right yeah context yeah like some of these are like cool words like pivot cascade but it's like that could be about anything like pivot probably more associated with like startups than anything else right and so you're like well how do i actually make this about marketing and so then it started giving me some like interesting marketing related context as you're talking about it and then i was like well i was figured we pick one word and kinda follow by marketing because for like the average person is not a marketing door they're not gonna just infer this thing is about marketing if you have like funnel though i kinda like signal to sale that wasn't bad and so then this is where i'm at now i'm still iterating on it we've changed dramatically from the first set of twenty to like the sixth set of twenty or whatever we're on right now and i could actually see like continue to go through this and i will probably go through like a thousand names but i think i will get to like a very interesting point where at least have a couple of good options am i doing it how you thought it should be done no i mean i think it's exactly right i mean in a perfect world you would have something earlier right that you feel good about but i think naming is a very hard job one of the because i've done tons of i've re brands or naming new products and the decision maker always has a very specific lens of what they want i mean i think i have ten or eleven kind of naming methods in here from compound names like you mentioned blended names foreign names and people have very specific opinions both about what they like in those categories and about what's perfect for the job at hand so this is designed to give you a variety of those types it's designed not to fall into certain traps like there is the compound word trap like if you just ask ai to name things it will use kind of compound or blended words more often than not because that's the accepted assumption of what works in naming so i actually reduce that down in here like i tried to limit it to forty percent or less of the naming by default and if you keep not picking it it'll go away and also i mean another thing that's happening here is we're trying to give you like you said a thousand names you might go through that's pretty standard like if you're doing a re brand or naming a new company you really want like a thousand names yeah in the spreadsheet that you're considering because that gives you the breadth of consideration that you need to find the right connections and the last thing i'll mention here i think it's very useful is you want quick iterations so we're we're specifically doing twenty at a time i formatted it so that it'll put three on a row so you can see them all at once you can process them all more quickly i really like that and then once you start seen the ones you like you can just hit their numbered specifically so you can just type the number back so you don't have to type names if you do wanna give more context like you're doing with quick sentence responses that's fine but if you wanna just go through twenty at a time twenty at a time twenty a time all you have to do is type you know like like one rate the number one right number four right number twelve and it'll just take that and run with it because it understands that's the input that it's expecting so like you said you've done this a lot you run an agency called social fresh you've helped a lot of companies do marketing my question for you is without like chat g which is what i'm using this a moment like how long would have this processed taken a few years ago to go through like a thousand names seriously yeah i mean the last re rebranding i did we probably spent i would say forty hours to get to a thousand names yeah yeah maybe a little less but like thirty to forty was time spent and that's not even you know you have meetings and you have reviews and you yeah it's it's a whole ordeal but just a naming process one can be pretty intense yeah that's over weeks if you're moving fast right yes that was over two months so exactly that was multiple feedback right and so what do you think it would take us to get to it here thirty to forty five minutes yeah i mean i've used this a few times now and i've gotten i would say a core set of like five to ten names that i took and then did some actual customer research on to see if you know i was getting the response i wanted it probably took me an hour max with each of the times i've used this yeah it's much much quicker yeah so you're you're talking about one day versus eight weeks and you're talking about an hour versus forty hours that's a massive time savings for i think what is probably as good or better of an output it's not like you're sacrificing the output i don't think you're just doing faster no i mean i think as long as you're giving the right feedback like at one of the rebranding we did the person got fixated on it being an actual name or like a foreign word that's much different than the use case you're giving where you know you want the second word to be marketing you know you want contextual to the industry and the customer as long as you're clear about you give that feedback at some point i think you can still get to the same quality i i agree with that i mean look like you said you're still gonna wanna do customer reviews and customer feedback and have some meetings on it but it's definitely cutting out a lot of that early stage work which is really good okay the third prompt you came up with is another one that i did and then i'm gonna hand it back over to you to talk about prompts four and five but the third one is something that i think most people are going to want to use right like this could be the most popular prompt from today's show which is all about ad writing and you call the messy ad writer can you give me a little bit of context on the messy ad writing kinda nomenclature and then i'll kinda walk through what i did and see if you you think i got it right yeah there's a couple things there i mean i'm trying to name things that are memorable yeah but i also am leaning into breaking expectations you wanna surprise people you wanna include absurdity contra thinking and there's a concept in the book called fast and ugly you know people have heard of write ugly first drafts but you also wanna move with speed and speed isn't as important as momentum so i think the messy perspective gives you permission to just not accept these as a final product understand this is like a working process and you're really just looking for inspiration to get you to the next steps to you know get eighty percent ninety percent there and then refine it as a human would so yeah i think being a messy ad writer as a required part of the process i think that's interesting because you know i think one of the best writers in the world today is jason his bull and he writes amazing songs and i was watching an interview with him a couple weeks ago and he was like when i write a song i just write it i don't edit it i put it all out and then i go back and i change and i edit it which is basically exactly what you're saying it's like for that initial version you don't want the constraints because you might edit out like a nugget he he talked about like i might write it all out and then find one nugget and then write a new song based off of that right and it's like if you're editing yourself down too much in the beginning you lose you lose the opportunity to do that and that's kinda what you're saying it's like let's open again the kind of the aperture possibility and then you can kinda edit dale once you have a direction that you like that you're going in am i getting that right yeah i mean i think that's song writers are a great example of this because they break so many rules all the time and and do well with they're great pacemaker makers and i think song writers will take songs and produce them without the actual words you know those fill in with nonsense or with humming totally so like sometimes you just need the shell of the idea and you fill in the details so yeah i think again aperture is a spot on metaphor there and i think just being open to a wider range of kind of risk taking ideas is is the goal here i love that in the prompt that you wrote here it's like we've got hooks and headline options for a product and so you're basically giving the ai ad hook writing methods so these are the ways to approach writing this if you're an ai right and you're giving it basically methods that i'm sure you that you've cover in the book and that some of the best ad writers use but what's interesting to me is that you have a step where it's like asking the user for feedback which we just saw in the naming prompt right how do you get that feedback loop how do you refine and repeat and then how do you like figure out who the winners are and then what the person using this prompt needs to do is put in the product the benefits and like the tone personality and so i tried to do this for hubspot customer agent product which is our ai agent that does customer support and handles website chat and calls and whatsapp customer porting inquiries and i wanted to see if the ai could research and determine what it thought the benefits should be because i always think it's fun to see what they can do and then i said the tone should be helpful and accessible and the one thing that is interesting that i did with this i ran it with two different models right first so it gave me these ten sets of options and i started with gp model o three o three is the model i use most of the time i'm in chat gp and they're like there are some good options right like there's thirty thirty seven second fix that clears a thousand ticket backlog like i like that that was good right and goodbye hold music hello hubspot agent that's not as good but you're like oh wow i like r robot b to the phone that's pretty i gotta like that one dude that is that is good and i was like oh these are but i wanna just be like just run it back again but this time i use gp four point five which is i'm in chad i could be doing this in cloth i think probably the best writing model of the chat cheap t models and so then it's like whole music that's so two thousand four you see a little bit more press one to speak with nobody because the sage agent never sleeps yeah your support team just got infinite coffee breaks like these are noticeably be better with the different model i think more personality yeah yeah like you could tell there is it's capturing like the tone and it's i feel like i need to give it less feedback right to actually get it right and to have something that you'd be like no i would go take some of these and run like a test to see if any of them like outperform what what we're currently doing right yeah and i think i mean a couple of things we did here with this prompt i mean number one yeah please for all of these i'm keeping the user input very short and quick so you don't have to add a lot and part of the reason that's possible is because i'm defining a lot of the work it's gonna do with those inputs in the rest of the prompt right so you're giving it a website and like the tone might be enough for most of these and secondly you know you're at a point here where you've gotten something you like i think some of these are very usable and you could keep going but we've also designed that it's again just like with the naming prop it's wanting you to judge these to go to a next stage that's what i just did what you're talking okay cool something i see with a lot of ai prompts is it's just a question and answer they don't really define a step two like even if there's steps in the prompt you're not telling ai what to do after that first output and i think whether it's a feedback loop or questions asked i think that's an important step and it really helps when building these kind of creative process opportunities and i think jason to build what you just said i i picked three that i like from that last round that we were just talking about and i think this feedback loop just gives you better outputs right like please hold said no one ever again thanks to hubspot is pretty good yeah that's good some of these are pretty good press zero to experience instant happiness what's the beauty of the prompts you've made is you can really rev through them like a lot and iteration is so important yes talk about that it seems like we're both going in the same direction i think you know there's two ways to scale ideas there's idea radiation and iterations so idea hydration is just let's put a hundred or a thousand ideas on the page to start with a group of people that's easier and that's helpful i mean those of these are very helpful and the more ideas you can get on the page or out into the wilderness the better but the iteration piece less work typically goes into iteration for most people even marketers it's like we may do a second round of the blog post editing and we may do you know a couple revisions on the logo but going like ten twenty thirty rounds of iteration that's where like creators and artists really live and i think ai helps him both into the scale idea radiation iteration and these feedback loops allowing you to type numbers to quickly iterate allowing you to see more of the answers on the screen at the same time these are designed so that people can do more rounds of iteration in less time you know to help our monkey brains get through these steps a little without getting overwhelmed and i think that's a huge leap for again widening the aperture and opening yourself up to a larger range of possibilities which is how these kind of collisions and connections happen more organically everyone if you want the prompts that jason and i have covered in today's show click the link in the description below so that you can go and put them into action yourself i just wanna double click really quickly for everybody you know if you're listening on rs if you're on spotify app apple podcast whatever you definitely wanna check out the youtube version of this because we are showing a lot on video but at the same time you just said something really important like the two inputs here idea iteration and iteration and you're like most people spend a lot of time on idea less time on iteration i will just tell you every great piece of content are anything i have been closely associated with or seen somebody do the thing that made it great was the iteration like the iteration and just the meticulous grind out iteration over a long period of time has what has made that in products so remarkable and the great thing with ai is the iteration is way less labor and way faster those are some of the reasons it was hard to do historically right it's like oh gosh it's gonna manually write like ten versions of this article and then i'm gonna be happy with it like that that seems daunting and now you're like oh with ai i can do that much faster in in a much different kind of way yeah yeah exactly okay so these last two i mean these are kind of more for our field meaning these are gonna give you ideas they're more in the bad idea direction they might not make approvals with the cmo right k you never not they're intended to be genuinely new directions get you thinking thought starters the first one we'll take a look at here is a square peg content engine and the concept of square peg is you know square peg don't go in around holes there's a whole part of book talking about this it's basically trying to fight back against assumptions because the original meaning of the square ground hole quote was actually intended to be the opposite which is you're typically not gonna show up in your ideal job or your ideal place in the world you're gonna be a square peg in a round hole but you might be closer than you think so the goal here is to get you to use constraints assumptions and really counteract those again by a little bit of contra thinking a little bit of breaking expectations okay so this prompt we're trying to come up with content marketing ideas really broadening our horizon on what that looks like get some inspiration the user inputs are i'm defining the customer as new jersey tackle gardens gave the website the brand voice fun source of activities community education interesting events and target audience families active adults and event seekers these are kinda standard audiences for botanical garden yeah so let's look at our results welcome to the plant asia rebellion inside tips for care plants things you can't do at a regular park i actually like that a lot monday parks compared to botanical i love that your horoscope but it's a tree i tell you one thing i've noticed when you ask chat for content ideas i like these because i think they get people thinking but it'll go to taro cards and horoscope quite a bit which is fascinating considering it's trained on the internet tells us how much of that contents on the internet exactly we asked three toddlers and a golden retriever to review or a botanical garden that's pretty good but i like that too secret nightlife life of plants rejected event ideas that almost made it a hundred percent honest garden faqs will i get lost yes and it's glorious yeah so i mean these are you know like these are pretty pretty good i think i was gonna say in all seriousness jason you and i consume a lot of content on the internet these are better than what most people are actually putting out there yes like they are i mean i i will say yeah ideas are more interesting you still have to execute on them you still have to like have the follow through make the video or the article or whatever you're making good but the actual like hook and angle is way better than what the average person is thinking of right now yeah and again i think sometimes when you just put a couple sentences out there to chat e and ask it to brainstorm ideas for you i think the ideas come back a little mid like more often than i would like bad sometimes i get winners sometimes i get things that shine through but more often than not and you could even see recently i saw a study of ai use cases from twenty twenty four to twenty twenty five and brainstorming used to be number one and now it's dropped down to like number seven and i think that's probably why i think the results just aren't quite up to what people are expecting from other quality use cases correct i mean i i think what i have found is that you don't have to give it a great prompt or great context to get it solid answer and if you can give it a great prompt and great context like if we redid this and we gave it a bunch of deep research on the new jersey botanical garden these are the ten best botanical gardens in the world and this is what they talk about here's like a really in endeavor audience profile if we did that it would even be it would be even better right like it might only be ten and twenty percent better but it would be better these are still very very good and very useful as it yeah i mean you have other knowledge blocks like customer persona brand guide examples of content you've already produced that's yeah it's huge context and i think i mean these work without that context and they're much quicker than ama all that context but together i would agree it's gonna be much better and i i know that because in my personal chat tb it has my whole history of all my clients and all my personal work and my book work yeah the context memory i've tried it in other chat gb and its mine is very much dialed into my personal like output right and what i prefer my taste then i think that's a larger piece of that kind of context block yeah the memory and chat at gp this total aside for for for people watching is like is the unwritten game changer of chat that that context everything there like jason cured and i recorded like i think like two days ago we recorder a show and one of the things we were asking for like raw and honest feedback on ourselves and like kieran kept pushing you know don't be nice don't be nice in and and finally it was like you're you told kieran your ten steps ahead and ten steps emotionally removed from everybody else and it like very like finally got cure was like that's so true i've never thought about explaining it that clearly you know and it's like that it's a good example of like how valuable the context of the interaction ever time really is harsh but true that's one of the things i did with the collaborative council prompts at that we showed at the beginning is asking it to be a little harsh because if you do that prompt without that instruction it e it's like mate i've done the same thing with like a a meal planning project and jack that i used for myself to kinda of pick the right food i wanna eat and it's like a coach and at at first it was a little soft it was a little like yeah you could do that but maybe you should do this with it and it was qui a little and i asked it to be a little harsh and it's so much better it's like no you cannot eat that food today it's stay away from that eat an apple instead and it's much it's you know it makes these decisions for me it's much more helpful with it and it has that strong opinion dude i did this whole like in physical mri whole thing because i i i'd like to not die and i uploaded everything because i don't care about my privacy uploaded everything into chat e and i was like make me my ideal daily schedule for a week like diet exercise sleep everything and it was awesome and it was just like it was just to accomplish like the goals outlined by like all the data and everything that i shared and it was incredible like i don't know how we lived in some ways like yeah i'm like far better at life over the last couple years than i was before for sure well yeah i need to bring it back to what we're talking about we don't even have the full context and full wide aperture that we could because we're not tapping into like data yet with these tools we're not tapping into history in a way outside of chat that exists like whether you have you know past emails sent or or blog metrics or sales you know all these numbers and pieces of context that are missing so just imagine how much better this can get much less these tools are also gonna get better along way yeah so i i think one of the things that's really really important is that context you just set jason this is really step one but like you could go and take some of these ideas and put them out in the world and then once you get the data and everything come back and the next round is just gonna be even better right like this is just like a starting point but the more you can keep the data and and feedback loops in this process the better you're gonna kinda continue to make the output yeah and you'll build them in your own process you'll find out how they work for you you customize them all of these can be customized for different use cases so run with them perfect alright we have one more we're gonna show before we close out today's show mark us through it man yeah so this fifth one it's a little similar to the content idea one but it's meant to be focused on campaign ideas so higher level marketing brain here also this is based on kind of the bad idea of methodology this is the core methodology of the book which is simply to start your brainstorming with bad ideas mh so these are intended to be bad ideas and how do we define bad ideas the two core ways are obvious ideas and absurd ideas so it's kind of a spectrum kind of boring and exciting even requiring so much in this prompt to say at least one of these needs to be dangerous oh i like it so again these are not likely to get cmo approval necessarily they may kind of challenge your brand tone in many ways but it's intended to get you to think so for this i chose un chapel hill one of my favorite colleges got tar heels and their business school as our kind of customer and product mh brand boys aspirational inspirational i just pulled this from their actual brand voice target audience for business leaders who wanna stand out more in their careers love it so let's run this bad boy green and box we ship you an nba in a cardboard box filled with branded pins buzz word flash cards high house recruit top faculty to live in a mansion and live stream dude that's a dope idea i would totally do that turn faculty and integrator survived the simulation students are dropping into a remote wilderness only syllabus with white that's it's fantastic star link and a piece of paper table for one please run a full campaign about how lonely isolated and self made success truly is wisdom for night owl make every class and events happen between midnight and five am there's some pros of wisdom in these ideas you know they're challenging our assumptions but all these take these into interesting they all make me think of the next like how could this work or what's a real version of this that could work build your own campus instead of coming to campus applicants must build a scale model out of legos top at tuesday's mandatory vintage business attire every tuesday awesome and then i think this is probably the violent one campus bon via the van students burn an item representing their former self on day one yeah so again you can pick winners from this you can continue to do iterations but all of these are meant again to widen your thinking and to take a few more risk within your kind of initial idea isolation process also like that you have like remix as an option in there where it's like oh i kinda like flavor this but like remix this into like a slightly different version as a cool concept yeah again you can write out that feedback and say i like this and that but it needs to be a little safer or needs to be something i can get approved or just give it numbers and it'll keep running and keep giving you a kind of a wild variation perfect i love that so what we've done here today is we've talked about creativity a lot but we've given five really amazing prompts that i think literally anybody can use i mean i i don't know in which somebody who cares about marketing or cares about business wouldn't use at least a few of these if not all of these i know that i have google doc open and we'll be using them a bunch because i love the rigor and the kind of formatting of them in addition to like the frameworks that you based them on i guess my last question for you is these prompts are great they're gonna help people but people still need to kind of have a couple of core like concepts and ideas in their head helped like guide their own creativity and like creative choices like what are the couple of things that you're like if you at least have these in perspective and in mind you're going to get a better creative result i think building your personal taste is an important piece i don't think enough people have confidence in their ability to make these creative decisions no so a part of that is honestly just making sure that you have that brushing up against life part dialed in and that's so different for every person it could be like adding hobbies into your life like learning other language taking up pottery classes it could be painting it could be you know vibe marketing vibe coating whatever it is like something there's a whole chapter on play in the book and one important thing about play is to remember that play is not the opposite of work it's the opposite of depression like play required oh i love you to feel better about life and have inputs and it's plays the practice of creativity you know without any judgment right without any results you have to worry about and play looks different for everyone like sitting down and writing of well researched paper on like the history of dinosaur discovery is something that might be really boring for some person and not get them into that play zone but could be very exciting for the next person right so play is very personal so finding those moments in life where you're it doesn't have to be adding a hobby it could be traveling more it could be hanging out with more interesting people more often really consuming things that are outside of your professional or career expertise so if you love sneakers just really dialing and geek out on those like finding aesthetic ways in your life where you're building confidence and your tastes making ability your confidence in in making creative decisions play as a part of that it could be board games there's all kinds of things there's a lot in in the book about it i think that's a missing piece and i think everyone has seeds of that but they don't really look at it as an investment they look at it as a nice to have if my life allows for it so i think that's something that really is a worthwhile investment and when we'll dial up your ability to make these decisions and also on the more kind of regiment side of this ask people what they like so if you're doing a a newsletter it'll say let's say if hubspot is launching a new newsletter based on your concept of where that marketing term comes along or maybe it's like i know you have a a sales newsletter maybe you're launching a customer service newsletter right coming up with ten ideas and literally just running it by customer service leadership people out there in the world that either there are customers or could be customers and saying which of these newsletters would you be most interested in reading based on the title and you do that for ten twenty fifty people you know you do the type of audience research that you can this could be linkedin dms this could be emailing out to your list could do whatever is like scrappy and quick because there's iterative feedback pieces are really important and doing multiple rounds of it is even better i think those two things so you have you know brushing up against like more doing more kind of feedback loops in whatever way you can i love it alright the case for more bad ideas it's out we'll put the amazon link in the comments below so go check out the book to get the full deep dive on everything the prompts we went on today's show will also be in the links below and jason thanks so much for coming on the show this is a blast i think everybody learned a lot about how to be creative in this kind of new ai air so thank you so much yeah i enjoyed it thanks for having

pot off the presses chat gp and open have just announced an integration with my company hubspot and that brings all of your crm your sales your marketing data in side of chat gp and deep research and it is mind blowing i think it's one of the most important things to happen in marketing and sales in years because it gives everybody their own harvard level analyst right inside of chat g for their sales and marketing and if you're a seller or you're a marketer you can get real time feedback and help on the work you're doing in a way that's really never been possible before it is a game changer we're gonna walk you through how to get started we're gonna give you a ton of free prompts and you're gonna be able to instantly start growing your business even better let's get to today show everyone we are coming in hot with some amazing new ai news and this time it features open ai and chat and our company hubspot and so kieran we had a mass announcement a few days ago and that announcement was that hubspot was the first crm to be integrated with open deep research product and open eye as part of that release basically their support for mc and they're kind of early vision for how they're gonna connect to a lot of third party applications why the heck does this matter why are you excited about it like let's give everybody a little context before we walk through how to do everything well i think it's really cool that hubspot was a very first crm platform to be integrated in chat gb so now we are bringing the power of hubspot right into your chat gb instance and for those of us that live in chat which is one hundred percent me and kip it could be a bit of an illness i i'm still in claude as well i do wanna say i get some notes from people saying you don't love cloud work i just do some cloud stuff in cloud last night but now you're able to get all of this rich rich content right in chat to you from your hubspot instance the actually incredible thing is for knowledge workers you can now have hubspot but what they released is you can connect it to your email you can connect it to your google drive you can connect it to your calendar and you can run deep research across all of these different tools to get one report one analysis one whatever you need and it just goes off and researchers all of the different data from these different tools and it's really a ten x feature that i think every knowledge worker is gonna be able to accelerate their results by using these tools like if you're a sales leader a salesperson to be able to look at that data in hubspot but also like overlay your calendar data with like how maybe you should be spending your time differently right like that's a game changer that can completely change your productivity your mindset around the problems that you're solving and we're gonna walk through all of this so what happened is this connector happens and it's in deep research we're gonna show you how to set that up and so it's available to anybody who has chat gp that has deep research which i think is all additions of chat gp except i think there's some limits on free and so i think if you're a free chat gp user it's a little i don't even know you know my ai more ai more ai i actually don't i don't even look at the here i just people how of ai so i actually don't always know what's available in the different tiers because i've just got them all but i haven't just got them all you the same i have them all for personal and all for work so i have i have every seen here every seat duplicated across every time i know for certain it's available in plus and pro personal accounts enterprise accounts ed accounts all of that and so if you're spending twenty bucks or more with chat gp you're gonna have access to this and it's available in all versions of hubspot including the free version of hubspot so that means for what we are showing you today you can do all of it for as little as twenty bucks right because if you have some contacts and some data in a spreadsheet you could put them in a free version of hubspot start doing some basic sales engagement within hubspot collecting more data connect at chat gp and chat gp can help you right so for as little as twenty bucks you can do everything we are talking about and that's twenty bucks a person it really does give you an incredible analyst and actually even some level of marketing skills sales skills that you can all then just take that information and action straight and help hubspot straight away yeah so i i think that's what's really important if you are a small company this gives you like a harvard mba sales analyst right for your business that you didn't have before for twenty dollars a month if you're a bigger company and you're an employee at a bigger company this basically gives you your own personal analyst versus like waiting for like a backlog of some analysts for your team right and that that accessibility and that availability of knowledge and advice is a complete game changer exactly okay should we start showing some stuff here get into it so just to anchor everybody when you are doing this you want to come to tools run deep research and sources and you want to turn on hubspot as a source or any of the other sources but in this case we're talking about hubspot you're gonna wanna turn on hubspot as a source for deep research and to do this you do need to go in your settings and o off hubspot to your hubspot account once there plenty of videos on the internet on how to do this and when you log in a chat gp you're often even prompted to connect sources like hubspot so if you want this to work properly you need to see research down here and hubspot turned on as a source k was that clear here and anything i missed there no i think you and i talked about off camera i've got all of them yes i've got like web gmail calendar jeep drive and hubspot switched on what we are not sure of is how good it's going to do if we don't give it specific instructions of what tool to go and research how good is is it gonna be to just know i should go into drive for this so i should go in hospital this so i think at the moment what i do is i say go to hot hubspot and my g drive yes to search for this data to make sure it does pick the right sources yeah or if you want to like look at a combination of data say it hey combine the data from hubspot and g drive help me solve this problem right and that right is giving it a little context of what to do the other thing kieran that i have found i don't know if you found this is this is not like just deep research on the web anymore this is deep research across really in indexed data like your crm data of your sales engagements your leads your opportunities your customers all that that's a lot of data and there's a lot of nuance in that data right so it takes a little bit of time what i have here is ten prompts and we're gonna share these ten prompts for free check the link in the description below and what i basically did here is i had chat gp go and look at all the data that was available in hubspot and for the purpose of this q and i are using a kind of a dummy demo portal with a fake business with a bunch of fake data but i asked it to go look at what data was available and come up with the use cases it thinks are the best to use for this integration i actually love what you've done and actually do a deep research to figure out all of the data it has access to and then actually you could build upon that and say okay well if i'm a sales manager based on this data what are like the top three so i think that's a cool way for everyone in terms of how you would get started is like ask ai what it can hear what can you do but kieran when i did that it did deep research for ninety minutes oh wow it i really went to try to figure out what it could do it's like okay better figure out what i can do it really really went and thought for it and do you wanna see what it came up because i haven't showed you this yet yeah let's do okay so what's interesting right is it pieced out what the business model was it pieced out the current growth priorities for the company what it thought was it pieced out the tools that it was using in the hubspot the most mh the target audience and industry focus oh jeez this is so good it's so good ai driven prompt ideas for growth nice ready here the ten that it came up with renewal email draft draft a personalized email to re engage a cfo at a large financial service company ig global financial corp about their upcoming contract renewal this email should highlight the roi we've delivered in the past year and the proposed upgrade a service for the next term that's a really good use case good use case yeah then you can automate that and then you are yeah pretty great place but with your renewal consulting case study post so generate three linkedin post ideas that showcase our solutions impact on a management consulting firm so like these are kinda case study lincoln post insurance webinar multi vertical content strategy i thought this was good up upsell strategy brainstorm we recently ran a successful pilot with an energy company eco energy solutions for two k and now aim for a two hundred and twenty k upsell brainstorm and upsell strategy what value metrics to present how to address any concerns from the initial phase and a suggested timeline for engagement to secure larger contract that's a dope prompt this also fits into my theory that ab is reimagine with ai and it actually now is pretty good and that actually what ai is going to allow you to do is do true account strategy but not ring fence to like large target accounts for anybody yeah you can automate all of these prompts and so you can have a very clear marketing in sales strategy per account and i think that is one of the things that fundamentally changes by marketing the sales i think this is really interesting and i think there's a macro point here this is not financial advice but if i were just thinking about something you and i could potentially do karen is you would potentially think about shorting in a large enterprise company whose whole differentiation is a very customized personalized sales process yeah yeah because that is going to change everybody is going to be able to offer a very personalized sales process and experience regardless of how much that potential customer may be paying you yeah and it's gonna be a massive disruption huge amongst how go to markets and sales and marketing teams work over the next couple of years yeah that's my frame you and i talked about this yeah and way san francisco is i do think this precision based marketing and precision based sales is going to be a new framework and is going to be something that ai is gonna help you be able to scale and this is like good example it's because you can have ai fundamentally figure out on a per account basis what your strategy should be because it has all of the data yeah so the upsell strategy brainstorm and prompt that we have here i thought was a prime example of that customer onboarding lead scoring enterprise success case studies deal nurturing follow up and then renewal negotiation call script think about if you were a sales or cs person this is a game changer for you right like it completely facilitates the insights and automation around so much of the things that you're spending manual time on so these are ten prompts they're gonna be for free but this is just like the base level broad scale what it can do it can do so much beyond this but this was to be emblem of what is possible with this new integration so i love this one right so what i was trying to figure out was one of the things you wanna continually do is refine your ic p mh because again if you're going to believe that precision based marketing and precision based sales become a thing the more you can iterate and refine your ic for everyone who is listening that's your ideal customer profile so who really is the ideal customer for your product that you wanna market and sell to in a time come by that is a pretty large undertaking you go and do like external research internal research now i can just say things like well you know analyze my top fifty close one deals and identify a common from a graphics by and deal behaviors and then a refined ic and suggests segment for targeting that's a great prompt by the way yeah it does this whole thing so i asked it for twenty twenty five it analyzed the firm demographic patterns of top deals so it tells me a lot about who are the top deals mid market tells me that about their employees tells me about their revenue gives me all of these industry company size locations breaks it down here a summary of some of these deals buyer role patterns and successful deals look how good this is so the average b b deal includes seven buyers so when you're selling to a company they're usually there's like on average seven people in that bar committee yep and so look so good it starts to parse kind the actual buyer rolls in successful deals c level and vp decision makers most deals were driven by executives or senior management ceo chief technology officer we also saw vp vps so it tells you the specific vps and then it tells you about some of the functional rules so it gives you the primary buyer roles and top deals so that i think that is incredible information mh the average deal cycle touch point patterns and then it goes all the way through and then gives me a refined ideal customer profile that's dope yeah it talks about the company size talks about the buyer persona who talks about the geo talks about the industry so it gives me the actual companies to target yeah and then you can just build a marketing strategy you can just have it right a new sales strategy right hey based on this new i see here exactly how would you update my sales strategy to increase my win rate and my revenue growth which is pretty scary because that's two prompts and i can have an entire sales methodology build out for my new ic and what i could do is get much more granular i'll give you one more and i flip it back over you yeah so i thought this was super cool one of the things if you're running a sales team you wanna be very cognizant of your deals at risk and so what i did was reviewed my open deals in hubspot identified the ones that are risk based upon the stage duration last activity and buyer engagement so basically you have a bunch of deals in your pipeline it's really hard to keep track of like ones that are at risk because there's no engagement or the engagement has dropped off and then i say recommend specific next steps or messaging to re engage your account mh so what we do here is we review all of the open deals in hubspot and we identify the ones that are at risk the stage duration the last activity and their a buyer engagement so based on that we recommend next steps so we actually do recommend to the sales team what you should do next and then we basically get this report back it goes through summary about risk deals so basically says hey like here's a bunch of deals this one here has being inactive for forty days gives me the stage no response since april the so it gives me a whole list and then it gives me this deal analysis and re engagement plans here let's look at this one retail e commerce platform is at risk the deal overview is forty two thousand dollars and they're qualified to buy stage since may thirteenth again this is a fake data it's in a fake portal last engagement was april to thirty over forty days when the client response the buyer showed initial interest in the next gen e com solutions however there's been no recent follow ups gives me the risk factors which basically says there's inactivity for six weeks and then gives me an email to re engage the person that i have to re engage so good and so if i'm a salesperson i just come in i basically create a table and the table here i could just add a row here and i would say give me my action to take that's my day right i could just go back in and re engage all my deals that are at risk and if i wanted to get really kind of sophisticated here i could go take the deal analysis the new ic apply any of the learnings that i've had here into this at risk action and say okay make sure the action is mapped to what we've learned about our ideal ic so next level data action it's actually incredible so good i think it's incredible something's come up in this conversation kieran and my head a little bit the dated action is now so fast and so accessible first of all i would say you tell me if you with me if i was the ceo or the head of sales at a company of two hundred people or less i would pay hubspot and chat gpu whatever it costs because i could run my business and have such a deep handle on my business is just we mind blowing good right like i would do that today the average person who has access these tools are so empowered so empowered i'll show you one more to give you the example please this is a really fun one for all of our marketers and sales people who loved to our together so if you're a marketer what are you always doing you and sales oh my god like we're generating you leads and you're not doing anything the leads are suck like you you know it's says just no one's in the right no one's in the wrong it's how we all live together right what you would love to know is okay well how are we feeling in the handoff so in b b there is this thing called the m sql outlet at m sql that's a marketing qualified lead and what a marketing qualified lead is is there some sort of intent and fit within that lead that would say this is a good fit for sales and we've agreed when a lead shows this kind of fit and intent whether it's a certain company size and they've gone to your pricing page where they've shown some sort of intent you'll all agree that this is a mark qualified lead and sales are not ready to go and work that lead and one of the things you always want to know is like where is that hand fail and there's a tons of money in that failure right there's tons of money of of where that hand is not working now in days gone by you would have had to go to your analyst and you'd would had to go to all of these different analytics platforms and pull data and do sql queries now i could just go review the last hand sql that did not convert based on hub hubspot form data lead scoring and sales notes identify breakdowns in the hand of process and suggest improvement so good so good so what it does all the marketers out there just like oh i know this is some marketers the side sigh of relief they're you're like oh it saves me so many pointless conversations oh my god right how like so let's look at the first one we have linda jackson she has elite score okay that's low actually let me see if they pull it's low oh there's a very area a couple very highs in here this is pretty good to know because these lo are probably in your data and you're looking at these mt and you're saying to the sales team why did you follow up in that in this team saying they're not very good and now you can actually say they're right right these are not ones you want them to follow on we have a very high one here so we do care about this one so we have maria thompson she has a high score she have the form source here we have the timeline and let's look at sales engagement very limited status open assigned but no outreach yet when did you wanna know that and no notes or fall offs recorded essentially she's waited two weeks only to be queued with no immediate contact you would say chat ep given the bin come on sales so what i what would i do i would look i would say to chat can you give me all the high and above q that sales did not follow up on because i'm going to go and give them the business that's what i'm gonna do oh on look get a fire emoji so let's see here we go he's got a little fire emoji oh yeah and i'm gonna go and say sales where's is maria thompson where's the david shannon where's the jennifer smith look at this yeah how long we work in b to b for how long would that have taken us to do that would taken days before forever and have been a bunch of debate about it right how do you not feel so empowered when you have access to these tools like if you are a smart person who can do work you're just so empowered i'll be honest with you if anyone watches the show or if you have somebody in your company or in your life who is an ai skeptic i'm like yeah ai i don't know it's not that good yet send them the show if you watch this show and you're like no i'm out on ai then i got nothing for you like i literally really don't know what to tell you right it fundamentally changes your job like this is just i could just because now what can do because i'm a cross person i don't wanna spend all my time in data and systems i can go and get those leads and i can craft marketing campaigns i can craft re engagement campaigns i can figure out actually how to do good work to get them to re engage to get sales to actually work these leads i can create sales automation campaigns so i can say hey like if they trigger high intent here you go i'm gonna craft all of this for you it's just such an incredible time to be good at your job because you have the tools that you can actually go and execute you know who's gonna fail at ai but know it all it's the people who think they're doing everything right right if you are curious for the problems to improve it has never been a better time to get better and get a little better every day and the compounding effects of that over months and years is literally life changing right you can just move so much faster here's my question before we show a couple last things on the show today do you think that we're gonna get to a place where everybody is doing too much and changing too much because we have access to all this like we're gonna change our ic every week and that's like a really dumb thing to do for example i would say this is a great question and i am one of the people who would be most likely to do that that's why i'm asking you because you wouldn't be one of the people most likely to do that changes you have how do you think about it what advice would you give people to not do that i actually think you can move too fast i agree with this i even think just in terms of the amount of things that i've committed to or taken on it's too much and i believe i'm feel too empowered by ai right and so you still need to have some consistency because for your team and i definitely have to always watch for this i sent like three different new strategies last week so i just digging into things yeah and so like for people on the other end that is pretty like dis because they're actually trying to work on the things they're trying to work on so i think there's is like a balance in the speed you can move and then having some concerted bets so maybe that's the best way to say it if all those things you should believe in a couple and really ensure that you execute in real depth in those things versus going too crazy on their breath i think that's true i'll give you by take and see if you agree your disagree discreet which is i think if you have common agreement of the singular problem or like couple of problems that you are obsessed over right oh my gosh our business is in trouble because our leads are not turning into customers i'm making this up right yeah and that is the problem we are ob obsessed then i think you actually then want to move through lots of solutions to figure out how to actually solve that problem and you wanna move it kinda ai speed to solve that problem if you were just un focused and willy nilly just like a cat on a keyboard with chat gp and you're all over the place that's where things are gonna go totally aw yeah i agree you have to be a problem obsessed to anchor you into the things where itself have to be because again the dan shipper quote that i love about ai is ai is a ba berserker for the curious mind yeah it's like a ba berserker for a curious mine that has unlimited realms of ammunition you just keep shooting that neighborhood ezekiel over and over you have to focus and like limit where you're pointing it and that's like i think the great leaders and the great teams are gonna figure that out yeah i agree great i think you still have to anchor yourself when problems worth solving and we've done a lot that other analysis and how we can actually work with the sales team and make sure that we are working all of the demand we get and here's another one which is marketers can just use it to do great marketing or a salesperson can use it to do great outreach and again this is a very lightweight prompt i could prompt it to be much better in terms of how it craft by the email but what i do is i say okay i've got this person i really need to reach out to today so i'm gonna give the name i'm gonna give quantum manufacturer and then i'm from promoting house hubspot crm and then it uses recent activities so it's gonna use recent activity that we capture in hubspot through page views email clicks to personalize the conversation so it could take your contacts which i love it can take all the engagement contacts love and the engagement context can come from your things you're clicking around red or even your call notes all of the things were captured within the crm and so we will put together this three step email and it says here i noticed you recently explored some of our crm pages right pretty cool very because it's gonna be a timely then it gives you manufacturing things like quantum it gives you the actual value prop which i think is pretty cool so that's the first email you know some engagement data in there some value props in there then it will follow up and say here's a value focused email so this one here is a re engagement based upon recent interest let's see what that's done here okay so it gives you like some value then it says here and based on your activity it looks like you're already exploring features that could save hours a week so again it does speak to the engagement data that we are capturing that the more you can contextual reference things that the person is doing i will tell you the better your emails will convert one hundred percent one hundred percent we have seen that and even better as if you trigger this so when actually you reach out to these kind of pages you trigger yes and the final nudge circling back offering a customized demo and then basically given a product so think this is a pretty standard outreach campaign probably still better than what most people do but you can do much better by crafting in the prompt what do you want that email to be but you have such rich data being captured that there's just no end to how you actually can personalize this three step email sequence to them honestly if you're a salesperson and you have twenty accounts and you do this exact prompt but replace the name and company stuff in the template and do this for the twenty eight counts and you just set it up in the sequences in hubspot to like automate them over the next you know seven to ten days yeah they're gonna work you're gonna get some good engagement on those and you're gonna close more deals than if you weren't doing that that is for sure if you're a salesperson and you just watch a show you could basically take the ic one and say well who am i closing like what deals am i closing and how can i do more of that then i can say great now i'm gonna look at my at risk accounts and who do i need to get back to next great and then i can say great based upon those added risk accounts and some of the personalized data you have craft email sequences to get back to all of those folks that is likely an hour of your time and you've probably done days and days and days and days of work right it's just incredible how fast you're gonna be able to move i could agree more if you're enjoying the show i know you want the prompts from today's show we took ten amazing prompts that i created for this episode and we put them together free for all of you you can click the link in the description below and can get those right now all for free okay i'll be honest with you we don't talk hubspot a ton on the pod we do it when it's really worth it and this is really worth it this is one of the most game changing things that has happened to marketing and sales in years i think do you agree that a hundred percent i think it's an example of how all of this works how we will work in the future and work at an accelerated rate got it and again if you don't have a hubspot account you can go sign up for a free one and give this a try and again it's for most chat gp account i think everything but the free account has it feel give a try let us know what you think drop any questions comments below and again prompts in the link in the description below thanks everybody we see you next time on i'm marketing against the grain

hey everyone we just recorded and my mind is spinning we did a pod with ga n who is the c under of captions dot ai and they just came out with an amazing video model that is just gonna completely change how you think about doing video we are going to show you how to make amazing ai social and product videos we got a founder on the show is gonna give you the mass extra class on what to do and the core use cases you are going to want to stick around for everything captions ai and their new mirage model let's get to today's show we're right back to today's show first i gotta tell you about a week that you're not gonna wanna miss it is a highlight of my year over year it is mail which is hubspot annual event what we bring together the best attendees is the best speakers the best experts in sales in marketing customer success in ai and we all learn together and we all figure out how to grow our businesses better in the coming year and this year it's no exception it's a fire lineup it's gonna be at the moscow center in san francisco california september third through the fifth so it's a great way to kinda close out q three and kick off q four really strong and have your heads right for twenty twenty six because you're gonna learn and hear from amy poe da ama armani of ant philanthropic dark patel sean evans from hot ones marquis brown league glenn and doyle and world's best speakers and experts across marketing sales customer service ai they are all at inbound hundreds of amazing sessions and you know it's more than just the sessions it's about the networking it's about learning from your fellow attendees your peers understanding what people are doing really well where people are getting stuck that is how you break out that is how you are going to grow better and faster in twenty twenty six you're not gonna wanna miss it you can go to inbound dot com slash register to secure your ticket and your spot for inbound twenty twenty five we are about to have an amazing conversation with ga n he is the c founder of caption dot ai they just released a new text to video ai model called mirage and i've been playing with it and it's blown my freaking mind i built a video promoting hubspot customer agent and what i did is i had chat o three model write me a script i put that script into captions i picked my actor my editing style and everything and what you were seeing now on the screen is just a one shot no edits no fine tuning i could make it way way better but like one shot within like fifteen minutes attempt at an awesome product video for hubspot customer agent and it's really good and by the way if i spent a couple hours on it i think it would be excellent and what's great now is you all have this power you have it in this new mirage model from captions it's remarkable i'm paying like twenty five bucks a month the fact that this is like twenty five bucks a month is literally making my head explode and so we're gonna dive in with ga he's gonna show you how to do it he's gonna show you some tricks you're gonna wanna stick around at the end kira and i are gonna talk about our use cases and at the very end we're gonna give you the one thing you should go and do immediately with all this information we got a fun one today we got a last second guest ga mis misha who is one of the c founders of captions dot ai ga you all just released a new product slash model yesterday called mirage and it is probably the best text to video that i have seen for kinda short form vertical video it's really really good and so we want you to come on and join us real quick and kinda talk about mirage some of the use cases and everything so thanks for being here today of course yeah thanks for having me and i'm really excited to chat about mirage you know this has been a long time in the making for us you know we started the company four years ago now like a little bit before sort of the ai hype even started and this is something we were thinking about back then but we didn't even imagine that it would be possible in such a short period of time like we were thinking like ten year timelines right and to see that it's become actually usable and actually useful in such a short period of time has been crazy as a journey and yeah happy to channel a little bit about mirage and give you a bit of background if that helps yeah i think most people's reaction anytime they hear the phrase text to video that know about it at all are like it's fine exactly like it's not that good i'm not sure exactly when i will use it maybe if i need a video and i need take a video from english to spanish i'm okay with using it for something like that but that's kinda the range it's so true and honestly like that's why we waited a while to really start on the video generation journey you know our goal has been as a company like let's make it easy to create video right and our target customer actually was sort of the long tail small business professional and worldwide by the way right and so when we started out we recognize recognized two main problems it's really hard to record a video because being in front of camera having the camera presence like it just doesn't come naturally to everybody and people don't wanna do it right and when they do it they still get just footage and like footage is half the journey and then have to edit it and like editing is super technical is a totally different skill and there's like so many technical terms and all that to get something that's actually usable right at the end of the day and so we wanted to solve these problems like we wanted to get these phones out of people's way so they can actually produce whatever comes to mind right and so mirage actually is really tackling that first side of the problem right which is recording how can we make recording really really easy i'll give you a little bit of background on this really quick about the space so when people think text normally they probably are thinking about like generating sort of b roll what we call you know what you might think of as like stock footage right like if you go to a normal stroke text to video generating website or company you'll type in text of something like oh like city scape of new york or something like that and it'll be like a shot from like a drone of like new york city or something like that but that's stock footage right like is that really that useful right like and we always question that of like why are we building a multi hundred million dollar models to create stock footage it almost makes no sense and really we wanted to focus on like that a role right which is like how do you actually tell the story right a lot of which is talking and like you watch a movie you know you watch a tv show even social media these days right is just mostly talking is communication right and b roll and stuff is there but it's kinda inter sliced you know some percentage of the time to enhance the story right it's we're actually part of the editing part of the product for us right so that's kinda why we decided to focus on mirage because we didn't think anybody was really building foundation models for this and we wanted to make sure that something like this existed you know solving the right problem for the user and so that's sort of the big launch that we did yesterday is bringing this to market finally with real use cases and we've tested a lot of this stuff in real life scenarios and not only can we match what people can do you know with traditional tools but we can even exceed it in many cases in actual specific use cases too which happy to talk about the one thing i'm curious about when you think about that storytelling tale problem you wanted to solve and primarily through the kind of people being able to tell you that story did you think about it through me being able to like clone myself and tell the story or me being able to tell the story through like these kinda ai avatars and maybe you can kind of integrate that into the kind of use case you're gonna show us yeah definitely and i think that's another interesting sort of point that you bought up around like there have been two types of video companies too right there's the traditional sort are text to video companies that are doing more b roll and then there's the avatar companies but if you look at the avatar side you notice that actually a lot of them are just using real people which they're contracting right and then they're sort of dub over them and so it actually ends up having a lot of the same problems that are production actually ends up having but like right contracts expiring and things like that i think the future that we see and by the way this will get interesting and maybe slightly dystopian so let's talk about we love a good dystopian break here on the show so i mean i could see a future where every brand in every small business kind of has a virtual person right it's like a likeness that they actually own its ip i could even see people trademark marking these likeness right as like part of their brand like this is our representative right that person shows up in all of their marketing in different places this the trusted face right of the company almost in a way and this might become very common right it's not a thing that happens right now but something that becomes very easy once you can just create people you know which mirage can do like mirage if you just describe i want a person of this type wearing these things in this location like it will come up with a person that looks absolutely real like indistinguishable basically and you can kind of have that ip of that likeness in your mirage studio you can make as many videos or different types of locations what are you wanna do with it which is kind of a brand new unlock almost which wasn't impossible before right yeah that is actually a fascinating point just wanna touch on that for the listeners because we actually have a creator program in hubspot where we work with a bunch of creators across podcasts in youtube and all of these different channels and they are like real people with real audiences but for the average s and smb b is never going to have a creator program it's like too much of a you know an investment for them but what you're saying is like in the future every s and b could have a creator program that is virtual creators who are fine tune to those channels to communicate with that audience and they can become the voice of the brand within those channels and their priority they're like licensed to that company so they're not going to appear anywhere else they're licensed to that company they can have their own personalities they can be very very good at that content because ai is doing the content which i think is actually a really good use case i would love to just hear like you've been doing this for some time now companies four years old do you think humans are going to be fine with the people they follow being ai influencers versus real people as long as the content is good like do you ever think through that problem or think through that scenario yeah i mean i think to be honest that is where the dystopian future begins right like i mean if people are okay with that whether if people accept that where you can start imagining a world where pretty much a vast majority of social media right like you imagine your tiktok and instagram meals and things like that are practically generated like you watch stuff today everybody watches instagram right you're scrolling through you don't know you don't know any of these people right like who knows if they exist or not like if i told you like yeah half the people don't exist like you would have no way of verifying that either right yeah and so almost to an extent you can imagine like the best algorithms well today are finding the best content and matching people with it right they're finding the best content in the world and matching people with like you wanna watch this you wanna watch that right future best algorithms in the world might be pretty much just fabric it out of thin air right like it's an unlimited sea of content that just never ends like whatever you're interested in there's more of that available right so yeah i could see that happening in the next five or ten years something of that nature right and a lot of it depends on people getting used to are people gonna accept virtual influencers and stuff my theory is yes because people won't be able to tell the difference and at the end of the day if it's entertaining and interesting and you know you can learn something from it i think people will watch it and the use cases abroad right like not just social media education tv movies like it's just very broad so yeah tons of possibilities i think what's interesting here is that if you're watching the show today you're gi a glimpse into how drastically different the internet and the social web are going to be it's just going to be a very different experience to consume content in the future i guess my question to both of you karen and ga is like if you had to make a guess an educated guess and put like netflix and like high quality streaming aside but like social video when is the majority of social video ai generated versus people generated like how long do you think i think it's already starting to happen like i would imagine that if you are tiktok and you're kind of monitoring synthetic content or if you're instagram you're probably seeing like somewhere in the one to five percent range at this point but i could see that becoming twenty to thirty percent in a couple of years so you think five years till it's the majority five years would be pretty much you were struggle to compete with what synthetic can do basically yeah as a real recording because the other thing that will happen that will accelerate this is like platforms like meta will offer this as a service and wait up their own avatars and influencers like that will one hundred percent happen so that will accelerate what you see in your feed i think we're two years away by the way i'm gonna go on the record two years i agree i like it i mean honestly i think you might be pretty much spot on here so i don't think it's crazy because i will say because i i want you before you have to go to talk about use cases in a second but as we kinda set up the problem and what mirage is and what you can really do with this technology now the reality is not only do you need a video editor not only are a lot of people not photo it takes a long time like it takes days or weeks to make a really good video and a manual process right now and when you could do it i mean i i was i made some this morning in like twenty minutes right and when you can take it from twenty days to twenty minutes that is a drastic acceleration of people coming online and creating that we're never able to do so before and this is also for a price of like twenty five dollars a month right you're not talking like thousands and thousands of dollars you're talking at a fairly low cost totally and i think one of the coolest things that we've seen and we wanna differentiate mirage from other models of course and like we wanna have our own sort of like specific focus that we really dive deep into and our focus really is on realism and acting that's where we kinda come right so like we're not gonna help you make animated characters that will like you could try it it probably works but it's not our focus right we're not gonna do like three d models and things with three d characters and stuff like that like disney characters right but when it comes to like very real looking people that's where we wanna excel right and that's where we put in a ton of effort right you can bring in an image of like kind of like fake looking ai generative image with like that you know the glow that ai has sometimes you can bring that in to mirage it will remove it it will make it more realistic right which is something we specifically worked on and then the second thing is acting right because literally i mean half the battle is like delivery right and i think what people forget is like body language is language it's part of language right it's called body language for a reason and it has to be good if you've ever seen a bad actor in a movie literally the definition is when their body language doesn't match what they're saying like them might be saying something but the body language is off it just like is not portraying that emotion that's bad acting right like you don't want that right so we focus specifically on like how do we make sure that the body language is exceptional like it should feel like the person went to acting school for two years and came back and then they're delivering the lines there right and so those are the two things we've put in a lot effort into and i think where we win basically against everybody else in a comparison so that being said that's something we're gonna continue focusing on and that's where we'll see like the most acceleration of like our capabilities you know in the future cool the one point just before we get into use cases let's say captions dot ai becomes a default platform for creating video and there's like other tools available as well and then most and smb are using that tool and using an o three to craft scripts i always come back to like what delineate like who gets the likes and engagement right because it's being created by ai it's using the same ai tools i think that's not unique to video i think about that everywhere when there's mass adoption of these kind of tools what delineate like the average from great right i think it's down to like human execution right but if you remove human execution and most of the executions is done by the ai and ai is like incredible the reason i was thinking through that sits because i was thinking about like legal cases like what happens if one side has access to incredible models and the other side has access to incredible models like how do you win right and so i think it's like an interesting point to think about i still think there's like human flavor you can add to things that will still like taste and things like that that will delineate what is better than everything else honestly i couldn't agree more i could tell you i'm the number of an user of studios studio like i think i use it pretty much twenty four seven and i make all kinds of stuff like i've made music videos i've made like you know marketing content and all kinds of stuff in at the end of the day like it's a skill right like yeah yeah i'll say it honestly it's not easy right like making stuff is not easy yeah even with the best tools in the world and even with something like roster you have to have a concept you have to think about like you know it's all the same problems that you normally might have solved like creative problems right problems off taste problems of like what is it that people actually wanna hear what is it that people actually wanna watch right if you don't have a good answer for that right like these tools may not help you and honestly even the gp and the o threes and the best models of today they're gonna give you generic answers of generic content that is not gonna resonate with anybody right right you have to have the angle right the how do i tell the unique story right like even if you take like some trending topic right that's happening today oh like tariffs or something like that right if you just go out and say like tariffs are happening like nobody cares so nobody cares to watch your video everybody know you know there's a hundred different pieces of content how are you talking about it that's a unique angle that's something that gets people interested is still like and by the way like gp is not gonna come up with it i can promise you that you can prompt it a hundred ways right right and so i think what actually is happening at this level right now is jobs are evolving right like the craft of how these videos are created now not just videos but content in general is just evolving is changing right it's becoming a lot easier but that also means that there's a higher bar for the type of content that deserves to be created right i actually liken in it quite a bit to like previous changes in technology that happened like you look at the music industry one of my favorite examples right there was a time where there was no digital music and it was just a acoustic like you would play the guitar if you can't play the guitar you can't be a musician pretty much right and yeah digital music came along a lot of people were like well this is just trash music right like this is not real music right and these are not real musicians a lot of people said that and maybe that's true i don't know maybe it's saw all trash music but the reality is like there's more music in the world there's more musicians in the world that bar is higher right and i think the same thing is happening here right i also like the software engineering analogy here like software engineering is the only job in engineering where you can imagine anything and make it right civil engineering you can imagine anything you can make it right and i think that same thing is happening to a lot of the content production where anything you can imagine you can sit in your basement and make it right you don't need physical processes they're not gonna get in your way so in a way so many more people are gonna be enabled to be able to make the type stuff that they could only have imagined before right and i think that's the power of all this now on top of that i will say there's companies in the world working on like general intelligence and things like that if those things come to fruition if general intelligence is created i think the world in chase in ways we can even imagine right now you know we're all gonna be out of jobs probably at all levels so as somebody who's sitting in his basement making videos this morning i feel seen and appreciated so thank you hey everyone it if you're like me you love learning from the best and you just love learning period and a podcast that is all about learning is one that i love it's called billion dollar moves it's hosted by sarah chen spellings it's brought to you by hubspot media and sarah is awesome and she covers really what it takes to builder remarkable business she's a venture capitalist she's a strategist she has really hard questions and wants to find the highs and the lows from the most successful builders and entrepreneurs of our time so that we can all learn from them and make our own billion dollar moves she's got a great episode around the big bet mindset and how you really build bold change for your company it's awesome you're gonna wanna check that out as well as all of her upset awesome that's highly recommend you can listen to billion dollar moves wherever you get your podcast alright we got a couple minutes left and we'd love for you to talk through like kind of the core text to video ai video use cases right now awesome cool i mean let me show you mirage to be really quick so it's available actually at mirage dot app that's where we've put it actually it's a different website we've done that deliberately to kinda get people on a brand new experience with this this is like my workspace over here you can see you can start off by basically uploading an audio file or generating one you can also choose these presets if you just wanna test it and so you bring in an audio file you generate one if you have a script so obviously you can write your own script you can use gp or something and we provide like a lot of the stock voices from all the top providers like eleven labs and so on or you can upload an audio so we actually find uploaded audio works really well because you can really specify how you want the lines to be delivered a lot of the use cases we've seen around this is like your typical performance advertising social media obviously like seo content and stuff like that which we can talk about but it becomes really easy you don't actually have to go through a lot of the process of production to make stuff so i'll give you an example like let's open one of these projects that i have so this is a product we already done you you can see the audio here after the audio is uploaded you can select actors you can go through this like audition process so let me show you that really quick actually so let me select this audio press continue here it'll show you like a little bit of a transcript so you can make sure everything's okay you can like adjust like the jump cuts and stuff like that where you want them to be in your video so you can move stuff around and it'll show you basically this actor screen where you can import sort of these existing actors that we've already created for you you can generate actors from text just for a description this you can write with gp or you can like write on your own you can also customize the background with just text so you can describe blurred background you know basement vibes whatever you want and then you can upload an image too so here you can literally upload an image of you know anybody you wanna a clone or you know a fictional character who created on another platform like mid journey or something like that and it will just use it one thing to watch out for here is like you wanna make sure that their teeth are visible like they're smiling or something so you know it knows what the person's teeth look like otherwise it's gonna create them out of nothing pro tip yeah exactly mean they're gonna be great teeth but they're not gonna be your teeth i could tell you that so actually well you end up at the end is something like this where you can cast a bunch of actors and have them play it out you can actually literally try different people and see what looks best like i little bit on this guy and by the way one of the coolest parts you can retake any line right so kinda like a real recording where you're a director sitting in a see thing like hey should redo that part can you like do this one more time you can do like ten fifteen twenty retake as much as you want and every time the actor will deliver the line slightly differently with like different movements hand movements like that's cool and you can pick like the combination that you like the best so here you can see like i i did two takes of everything right but let me play this house so you can see what it looks like there it goes kira weekend buy an acceptance camry with low three point nine nine apr financing or get loan apr financing on a stylish new corolla sedan it's go time toyota is on toyota let's go place it so as you can see like the hand movement the ge all that stuff like it's fully customizable right you can actually say like what the part where he's pointing his finger let's go places is you can regenerate that and it will do a different hand gesture right it will he'll move his head differently he'll like express it differently and you know each one and have a little bit different so you can be the director and pick like actually that's the right one and by the way next up coming on this is you'll be able to literally say in words right like okay redo this but like you know raise both hands like two finger right see and so crazy it'll be a full on like you are the director make the video how you want right and the person obviously doesn't exist right this is not a real person and you can see like the skin realism and stuff we focus a lot so good i'm making that like exceptional so that's a little quick run rundown but let me actually show you i can show you at least one video but maybe two where we've made an ad with this so it's actually launch video for mirage all the footage in it that's the payroll footage we generated and you'll see that it's kinda just like a japanese inspired studio setup up with a japanese street where sort of clothing style you'll see like if you were to go and find someone to record this for you with this setup and this type of clothing and this person like it would take you a lot of time to find this person right and here you're able to like customize pretty much exactly what we want so this is the first frame of the video but you can see like this person doesn't right we customize this person like even the hat they're wearing right like the studio behind them right the lighting the mic like all this stuff is fully customized and you'll see a second person come in as of this video plays and you'll see the same thing where that person doesn't exist either but like looks exceptionally real all the footage was generated in less than an hour right i actually generated a bunch of it some people from the team help generating parts of it but it's very usable and if you watch this ad you'll see this is like an example of a solid performance had amazing hook like it'll work right so just to show you what it looks like overall need a talking head video but don't wanna get on camera here's set to generate one in under five minutes without beer lighting or filming anything you type in a script choose an actor and mirage studio generates clean expressive video this is the first cinematic work but for ads product demos explain your videos and landing pages it's fast and the scales you get ninety percent of the impact without ninety percent of the production for marketers founders or anyone scaling content without a production team mirage studio built for scale that is by far the best ai created video i've seen and just to give you in captions and everyone a reason to go use this in a recent survey sixty seven percent of b b buyer said their primary way they want to learn about your product is short from video is like a clear use case of why i would use this product straight away no it's super exciting because that is dope i mean look at this person we're like that last how she likes so good moves her head like we did multiple takes to get the perfect movement and stuff right i would not have known that was ai it's crazy biggest compliment i can give there's nothing i could have picked up on like i feel like i can usually pick up on the video apps because i spent so we speak we spent so long looking at tools and in the weeds but that is just so good how many hours you think went into that video to make so this was made literally over the weekend yeah you know which is not a great thing for our company we had to work over the weekend to get this lunch done but we generated the footage in probably an hour about all the footage and then you know editing and stuff yeah so over the weekend maybe two days so good it's a pretty sick video for a a two day project yeah i mean i can promise you like there's no way we could have done this mean we may not even have been actually practically been able to do it like how would you find this person with this setup and in this environment and this clothing like it just go to tokyo all that recording in the edits right i'm just like a tokyo like recording student like podcast studio with a person who speaks perfect american english like it just all the combinations like almost impossible you know where did the b roll come from because i was creating a video early on and i was like wondering how do you splice the all the kind of like cuts you have so in this video the b roll is real b roll it's like real actual footage from like okay like a professional videographer photographer but i'll show you another video where the b roll is generated so we don't generate b roll so you can use like a ton of like different websites in the captions mobile app we also have a lot of companies that generate b roll integrated like luma labs is one of my favorite ones they do like really good text to video pi is another favorite of mine yeah they do a little bit more like fun stuff but good b roll so that's kinda what we would usually use for like b roll so let me show you another video this is a little bit more crazier it's the music video it's like nineties inspired wrap video the way this is what i'm going to use it for as soon as this is my dream oh in able to create a music video so i will also be trying to do this with that mirage let me tell you this like it is so addict yeah i've been using sun if you've heard of them they do like yeah yeah yeah beats yeah so good like the music turns out amazing like you have to generate a few times to get something you really like but once you get it and then you're making the music the video it's so much fun like i was up till two am making music against this ridiculous this is my entire whatsapp third of kieran and it's just gonna be him sending me random yeah original use ai music and videos for like the next like two weeks you were talking to someone who used to hire puppet some fiber to do battle wraps and send them to people in hotspot hubspot that's the okay like i will be all kind of addicted to this it's great to be honest literally super addictive yeah i there's people with the company like also sometimes i'm like how is this my job like i i know i really it doesn't make any sense but check this out royce this is like a nineties inspired rap video that our video are put together i generated a bunch of the footage for this myself but you'll see what it looks like palm to on the horizon in the valley sheets where the sharpest night acting like a legend brought the screen lightning scenes with the slice yeah that's gonna hook and everything curing done for the rest of the dead oh god i'm logging off scripts written mirage strings ag sign truth mixed with last seems got look its eyes call it a phantom on the start won't die oh my god my god scared never been so happy and my god that is just so good that's so good you should release that curious it's like i i'm gonna to stream that on spotify pop oh i'm just thinking about like me and my brothers used to use the puppets and five to battle wrap each other and so we would write scripts and then send them got like there was actually like a puppet with wrap and i would send my brother this is just a futuristic version of what i can actually do now is i can create battle wrap dis and videos and avatars i might actually have to quit my job for because this might be all of my time now i actually my create i got a whole bunch of ideas i need to see off i'm all i've too many ideas that was awesome awesome no great to hear it and yeah we'd love to see what you create i i would love to see some puppet wrap so but in all practicality to kinda close out because i know you gotta jump it's really ready for social instagram rails tiktok youtube shorts and it seems like it's really real for any kind of like website or email video like if you're like hey i've got a prospect where i know that i've got a page where a certain profile a customer is coming to and they need this very specific message i can basically deliver a great thirty to sixty second video in places that i wouldn't have otherwise done and you've also you you told me when we chatted last week that like there's a lot of people just using this for seo yeah people are putting these videos on web pages to get extra engagement time short from product video that's perfect use case short form product video i mean it's huge the seo thing works quite well because you know a lot of the text seo is getting eaten up by gemini and stuff these days as you guys know and if you convert it to video gemini i tend eat it as easily which is nice and potentially more engaging you know which is which is good too yeah long tail short form product video yeah strategy that's a perfect use case for seo yeah alright i feel like we have like a a hundred ideas now we're gonna do a little bit of a close out ga i know you got another call so we'll we can let you jump across thanks for doing this last minute man we appreciate you thank you thanks so much you you gary bye can producer darren come in yeah can i get the real hot take from producer darren of what he just saw on mirage as somebody who does you play music you are deep into the audio video world like what's your take producer darren yeah i mean it's it's amazing it's kind of baffling isn't it just to watch that because it's i mean you can't tell it it's not real you know so it's a it's kind of a mixture of scary and exciting you know mh it's always it was better than you thought was gonna be yeah i mean the thing that's really surprising is because with a lot of ai stuff when it cuts from scene to scene you can see there's like differences between the characters but with that one it's like the is amazing isn't it it's much better than i thought it would be as well i played around with it this morning i think to mcguire point there is still some skill in learn and how to use the tool because i didn't actually know you could do the repetition of takes mh the repetition of takes feature is fucking bananas man yeah it it's so good so i like i need to do that the b roll is a big thing so i'm glad he talked about how you can get b roll and added to the video because i wasn't sure how you could actually integrate the payroll roll but the video he showed which was the ad for the actual tool i would not have known that was ai mh no it was bonkers good this is my take you too and i'd love to hear if you agree or disagree screw with this i think if you are the average small to medium business and you've got a couple of marketers this product is good enough for you to do your vertical social video and do some product videos on your website that you would have just never had the time or money to make for sure i would go and do this now i think if you are a large to enterprise business i think i would still use all of the avatars and the scripting and the takes and everything to get all of the a roll which is the person talking on screen and the audio i would then probably have a similar flow where i generate b roll in one of the products that ga was talking about lu or what have you and then i would probably have a very high speed editing process set whether i have a dedicated editor or i maybe have a team in a different time zone that can put the a in the b together quickly overnight and have like fast turnaround that's where i think we're at like what you guys agree or disagree with that i think if you use that tool and you have someone that can use that tool you have a whole video team mh and so the average s and b can actually have an entire video strategy like as part of their marketing strategy which is never really possible to begin with i also think his idea of having licensed avatars to your business so cool be the face of your business and train them on those channels is actually really good because people will will build a relationship to that person they'll recognize that person that person's associated with the brand put them on your team page i think that's a great use case as well that is not being done yet and so i think there's a ton of things in there if you just got the tool and started with short form product video you're in a great spot what's that's what was saying if you're watching the show today you're in the early crowd and there's a arbitrage to take advantage of what you can literally do and and kieran i think we might wanna do a follow ups show on this where we'll make some videos in mirage where we'll take copy from product pages like we'll just take some hubspot product pages take that copy have chat gp convert that product page copy into a sixty second script to explain that product and then we'll put that sixty second script in mirage pick the actors and everything and generate that and we you should be able to do all of that like you should be able to do each product in like twenty to thirty minutes right start to finish and like that is a game changer you would have spent thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to do that before and this is literally i paid for it this morning twenty five dollars a month this product right that's the use case there's a window where you will be able to take advantage of that for everyone else is actually using these tools yeah and we'll do a show on how to do this but we'll also put some of these videos on the site and we'll come back and try to report back traffic changes engagement changes are we getting more search traffic everything but from the people i've heard doing this early on it's working pretty well yeah it just feels like this is an obvious brainer yeah it's a no brainer again it's a arbitrage opportunity there's a window where you can actually get real benefit from this i feel like we've done hundreds of shows now there's probably been like twenty that i i've seen kirin mind be someplace else because he's like thinking of what he's gonna do and this is one of those shows yeah i have just so many ideas on videos i can build him i just like so much application and it feels like every week we show up and we get like i feel more powerful yeah yeah like oh i can make videos now i could never make videos before this is amazing gu description of this is the right description which is there's just a bunch more people who can create music now because of these tools this is what these tools are enabling for now is that if you have good ideas if you have great taste then tools and expertise are no longer you're dime like you don't have to wait for a videographer you don't have to wait for someone to do the tool in netted and you can just go create and i think that's a cool place to be yeah like i want hundreds of people within hubspot making videos and right now we have exactly democrat people making videos right like that change in magnitude is remarkable and what's great is those tens of people who are really great specialists are going to kill it like they're gonna use this to make even better stuff even faster and then the rest of us who are not superheroes on video are going to have a really good video someplace where a video just would have never existed before right just to democrat it to the best ideas it's kinda of mind blowing just for context where we watching this was a last minute show i was like texting with ga last night to get this going but i'm really glad we did it because i think we're gonna look back in a year and be like this launch with mirage was one of the tent pole moments for ai video like you had google's v model you have a few of them but like what ga and the team of caption has done with raj as they have gotten quality for a very specific use case really good right if you are making a vertical video especially for social media you can now do that very well with ai i was talking to him off of mike care karen for you out on and he's like the amount of adoption and gpu usage in the first twenty four hours has been off the charts yeah yeah they've hit that viral take off moment they hit it and now it's just like they're hanging on for dear life to like keep up and that's how you know you've hit like the next level of something good with these new technologies alright so that was mirage it's a new model from caption ai it really democrat short form product videos and social videos in a way that's never happened before here and i are blown away by it i highly recommend you go and check it out and you can really use it to participate in video in a way that you probably never been able to do for your business i have so many ideas i'm gonna go and play around with those now thank you so much for joining us and we see you real soon on marking against the grain look on the show we have reached the good word about how ai is completely change in the game for content for creators and for marketers but we've never given you the exact steps you need on how you can change your content creation workflow that is until now we just drop a step by step guide on which ai tools you can use today to start ten your content creation workflow learning ai for content creation has never been easier you can steal our entire process right now link in the description below alert alert we have a major announcement that you need to know we've got some big news hubspot crm and gp from open have come together for an amazing integration hubspot crm is now the first crm to integrate with chat gp pre research bringing all of your customer contacts and data from hubspot into chat gp now you can do truly remarkable things to better grow your business marketing teams can find the highest converting cohorts and create tailored nurture sequences and then use those insights to launch automated workflows right inside a hubspot sales teams can effortlessly analyze deal pipelines identify at risk opportunities and receive ai guided suggestions for 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